I certainly hope so. The party has moved noticeable to the Right on some economic-issues like privatisation and public-sector reform. They must resist all pressure from the Irish Times and the PC-brigade to return to the failed Fitzgerald model of a Social Democratic FG, the legacy of which consigned FG to also-rans for 6 General Elections. If they have the numbers after the GE, they should ditch Labour and its reactionary stance against public-sector reform.

Originally Posted by FutureTaoiseach

I certainly hope so. The party has moved noticeable to the Right on some economic-issues like privatisation and public-sector reform. They must resist all pressure from the Irish Times and the PC-brigade to return to the failed Fitzgerald model of a Social Democratic FG, the legacy of which consigned FG to also-rans for 6 General Elections. If they have the numbers after the GE, they should ditch Labour and its reactionary stance against public-sector reform.

I agree, they should do as you say and get completely eradicated, it would be a blessing to our country (all 32 counties).

Originally Posted by Cogadh

I agree, they should do as you say and get completely eradicated, it would be a blessing to our country (all 32 counties).

They tried the leftwing approach and were eradicated, notably in 1987 and 2002. It is only now, with them returning to their roots, that they are leading FF in the polls. You are mistaken.

Originally Posted by FutureTaoiseach

They tried the leftwing approach and were eradicated, notably in 1987 and 2002. It is only now, with them returning to their roots, that they are leading FF in the polls. You are mistaken.

Not at all, my friend. They never tried a 'left wing' approach, they were only ever pseudo-liberals against nationalism and republicanism.

Originally Posted by Cogadh

Not at all, my friend. They never tried a 'left wing' approach, they were only ever pseudo-liberals against nationalism and republicanism.

I disagree. Noonan came out as a Social Democrat before the 2002 elections.

Originally Posted by FutureTaoiseach

I disagree. Noonan came out as a Social Democrat before the 2002 elections.

Noonan, oh jesus, fúckin Noonan... don't get me started

But just to put it in perspective, Bertie Ahern also came out as a 'Socialist'. What Irish political leaders say and what Irish political leaders do, can be - and often is - two different things.

Originally Posted by Cogadh

Noonan, oh jesus, fúckin Noonan... don't get me started

That man is best airbrushed out of FG






Irish Democrat : Book reviews : Eoin O?Duffy: a self-made hero

Originally Posted by Cogadh

Noonan, oh jesus, fúckin Noonan... don't get me started

But just to put it in perspective, Bertie Ahern also came out as a 'Socialist'. What Irish political leaders say and what Irish political leaders do, can be - and often is - two different things.

It doesn't work as well for FG though, since many of their traditional voters would have been conservatives, and who largely stayed home or defected to the PDs in 2002.

FG losing so often has little to do with whether it is right or left wing and everything to do with being craply organised and having useless media and PR etc. It was only when FitzGerald hired - and paid - proper professional media and marketing people that the party did well and again when Kenny hired - and paid - proper professional media people in 2002 that things improved. Bruton was utterly useless as running a party as was Dukes and Noonan - I think they were all great parliamentarians though just rubbish at the party or stuff.

Then there was the issue that no matter what 40% at least of the public did not want to know about honesty or truth or the right thing - the same people voting for crooks and sleaze bags of the lowest order and now we know the same 40% who did nothing to stop child torture at the hands of religious orders in Ireland. If it wasn't for Fine Gael pushing a liberal agenda under FitzGerald then Ireland would still be in the death grip of the catholic church.

Originally Posted by Lloyd-Apjohn

FG losing so often has little to do with whether it is right or left wing and everything to do with being craply organised and having useless media and PR etc. It was only when FitzGerald hired - and paid - proper professional media and marketing people that the party did well and again when Kenny hired - and paid - proper professional media people in 2002 that things improved. Bruton was utterly useless as running a party as was Dukes and Noonan - I think they were all great parliamentarians though just rubbish at the party or stuff.

Then there was the issue that no matter what 40% at least of the public did not want to know about honesty or truth or the right thing - the same people voting for crooks and sleaze bags of the lowest order and now we know the same 40% who did nothing to stop child torture at the hands of religious orders in Ireland. If it wasn't for Fine Gael pushing a liberal agenda under FitzGerald then Ireland would still be in the death grip of the catholic church.

Fitzgerald's experiment with Social Democracy saw FG drop from 39.5% in 1982 to 30% in 1987, which it is only now recovering from. Don't go down that road again.