Peter Sutherland

[mountainyman]

Some say Suds is a big hero but someone said to me today that he had structured the WTO to ensure that hardship was borne disporportainately by the world's poorest people and millions of people had died because of how he structured reform.

The same person also said that suds had locked up a load of peace protestors when Reagan visited Garret. No WAY I said.

They also said that Garret got a IR£200,000 debt written off by AIB. NO WAY

[FFrCRAP]

I shouldn't really be replying to silly posts like this but I suppose when the alternative is study I'll reply to anything!

Some say Suds is a big hero but someone said to me today that he had structured the WTO to ensure that hardship was borne disporportainately by the world's poorest people and millions of people had died because of how he structured reform.

It seems you or your 'someone said to me' has already made his mind up with regard to Peter Sutherland. With regard to WTO reform your assertion is ridiculous. Reform in Trade has, as ever, been painfully slow (as evidenced by the current Doha round) but it's wrong to blame this on a single individual.

Big Bang Trade Liberilisation would be wrong also and would lead to a race to the bottom for wholesale prices that would hurt producers in developing countries. Trade reform has to be done in increments. The Uraguay round ('92/'93) was the result of painstacking negotiotions between the EU, US, the Cairns group (fast developing countries who export Agricultural products), NGO's and the WTO itself. It's success or otherwise can not be levelled at one man (Sutherland). In any case it did see some movement in tarriffs and increased trade for developing countries.

Indeed even the small changes implemented by the WTO under Sutherlands tenure had big effects. Here in Ireland we've had the collapse of our textile industry, and the increasing substitution of goods from developing countries (e.g Brazilian Beef).

Does 'mountainyman' support 'big bang' trade liberalisation rather than (slow) incremental reform esposed by Sutherland and others? Because 'big bang' trade liberilsation would hurt Ireland's Agricultural and manufacturing sectors in a big way.

I think Sutherland, like Hillery, David Byrne and dare I say it, Charlie Mc Creevy, distinguished themselves on the European and World stage when freed from the partisan rancour of domestic politics. (note how I left out Flynn )

The same person also said that suds had locked up a load of peace protestors when Reagan visited Garret. No WAY I said.

He was AG at the time. I was only a toddler then so I can't comment with any certainty about the visit. As far as I know a handful of people were arrested for civil disruption or something. I'd imagine the Gardai 'locked them up' rather than the AG. Anyway Fitzgerald did give a speech during the visit outlining Irelands objections to Iran-Contra and other aspects of US foreign policy using fairly forceful language (or at least more forceful than the nonsensical gibberish about Iraq spoken by Mary McAllesse and Bertie Ahern during the visit by Dubya). In addition there were widespread public protests about the visit by Reagan.

They also said that Garret got a IR£200,000 debt written off by AIB. NO WAY

Indeed. He was Chairman at the time, so it can be presumed he wasn't involved in the day-to-day running of the Bank. Who knows if he was involved in the decision? AIB also wrote off loans for Charlie Haughey, maybe they felt they would extend the same courtesy to Fitzgerald as they did for Charlie.

Just for the record though, Fitzgeralds loans were to pay for his wifes substansial medical bills (in contrast to Haugheys which paid for his Mistress and mimmicking the habits of the British Ascendency in Kinsealy ). At the time politicans salaries weren't at the obscene levels they are at now, so it understandable how Garrett Fitzgerald got into financial difficulties (and of course he didn't have a collection of cronies to have a 'dig out' for him a la Bertie! )

You could level legitimite criticism at Sutherland for the enviromental damage done by BP (of which he is chairman) but then you have to assert that in all likelyhood a non-executive Chairman would have little knowledge of the day-to-day decisions made by the company that have implications on the enviroment. And of course you would balance it out by pointing out BP's small but growing investment in renwable energy.

The only bad thing I could say about Sutherland is that he has quite a refined accent but I've noticed it is a poor infliction sufferred by nearly all in the legal profession. Shysters do like to talk 'proper'.

With regard to yourself I've noticed you've only made a handful of posts. One of my first posts was about Noel Dempseys (then) plan to re-introduce 3rd level fees. At the time I was foaming-at-the-mouth with anger at the proposal (hence the partisan username) and my posts at the time were full of F*** this and that and unreasoned and silly statements. All of us say silly and stupid things from time to time, so I'm going to presume that you starting this topic was just a mistake on your part.

[Catalpa]

Sutherland is an arch Capitalist with a global political agenda.

Annan has charged him with pushing further Mass Immigration into the 1st World States incl the ROI.

Not a character I would have much admiration for.

I don't think he even lives in Ireland anymore.

[Jimmy Sands]

I don't think he even lives in Ireland anymore.

How dare he!

[Catalpa]

I don't think he even lives in Ireland anymore.

How dare he!

exactly - he is a supporter of Mass Immigration into Ireland yet he won't even live here.

Even if he did you can be sure he would reside in some exclusive estate where immigrants are thin on the ground.

I doubt he's send his kids to a school where 40% of the others kids are from the ethnics.

[Jimmy Sands]

Not at all. What could be more consistent that advocating immigration and being an immigrant himself? As for where he sends his kids, I assume it's somewhere posh and expensive. "Ethnics" will have nothing to do with it.

It seems the one thing an Irishman can do to make himself unpopular on here is to become successful. Fair play to the man.

[Catalpa]

Not at all. What could be more consistent that advocating immigration and being an immigrant himself? As for where he sends his kids, I assume it's somewhere posh and expensive. "Ethnics" will have nothing to do with it.

It seems the one thing an Irishman can do to make himself unpopular on here is to become successful. Fair play to the man.

But successful at what exactly?

It all depends whether he is doing good in the World for the sake of helping others or just usiing his considerable intellect to line his own pocket. That's not exactly illegal I admit but it's hardly admirable either.

He strikes me as being a bit too smug in the way he views his fellow countrymen and women.

[Jimmy Sands]

Successful in his chosen field of endeavour.

Smug? If I'd a career like that I'd be putting up statues of myself.

Feck the begrudgers. As a people we're far too prone to tall poppy syndrome.

[ireland2004]

I don't think he even lives in Ireland anymore.

How dare he!

exactly - he is a supporter of Mass Immigration into Ireland yet he won't even live here.

Even if he did you can be sure he would reside in some exclusive estate where immigrants are thin on the ground.

I doubt he's send his kids to a school where 40% of the others kids are from the ethnics.

Where does he live?

[rockofcashel]

Just a correction for you FFrCrap, in case you heard wrong at the local FG cumann.

Just for the record though, Fitzgeralds loans were to pay for his wifes substansial medical bills (in contrast to Haugheys which paid for his Mistress and mimmicking the habits of the British Ascendency in Kinsealy ). At the time politicans salaries weren't at the obscene levels they are at now, so it understandable how Garrett Fitzgerald got into financial difficulties (and of course he didn't have a collection of cronies to have a 'dig out' for him a la Bertie! )

I don't know where you got that story from ...

Garrett Fitzgeralds debts had nothing to do with "his wifes medical bills".

Garret had been given a tip by one of his "friends" that Guiness Peat Aviation (a successful aviation company in the mid-80's), was a "sure thing" when it was about to be floated on the stock market. He was advised to "borrow" a substantial amount of money, and buy stock, and when the stock rose, pay off the debt and interest, and make himself a healthy profit.

Unfortunately for him, the stock bombed, leaving him with worthless stock, and a hefty loan bill from AIB.

Unable to pay off the loan, he had the bank "write off" his debt.

Can't remember was this just before or just after Peter Sutherland got the Irish comissioners job at the EU, but which or whether, I'm sure it was in no way related to the writing off of the loans.