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Last edited by Bedstore; 10th October 2008 at 07:55 PM.
No of course no one would doubt that the government is going down the road of privatising parts of the health service, but so what?Originally Posted by Bedstore
I recently had a family member who needed a scan. In a public hospital we were told the wait would be four months - for a scan that takes 15 minutes????? We asked about and a private hospital (the Beacon I think) booked the scan within 48 hours at a cost of 150 euro!
Now it occours to me, am I am trying not to sound nasty, but when someone claims they or a family member got cancer or some other horrible illness because they had to wait 6 months etc for a scan, that in that peiod they could not have russeled up the cash to get it done privatly is beyond belief? They could not beg, steal or borrowed it? Under public private partnership the money could then at least be re-embursed. Under the public system there is no hope of even getting a timely diagnosis, yet alone an accurate one apparently.
It seems it has become politically expedient for members of the oppostion, unions and the media to watch poor people die, without ever pointing out the bleeding obvious - that parts of our health service are beyond repair or saving and the model of free public health care (there is no such thing as free anyway) born in the middle of the last century, was never going to work as entirely as envisioned. It should not be abandoned, but neither should it be closed to change or evolution.
I am not in favour of privatising the health service, but the cold facts are many working in the public health service don't give a f**k about the patients they are supposed to care for. If private facilities can be paid for to deliver services at a fraction of the cost and time needed by public services, then so be it. Give them the money and the job - the public sector has proven nothing but a headache and incapable of doing the task. Our hospitals are not only inefficient, but filthy too. From top to bottom, minister, doctors, consulultants, nurses - all have failed and all still have their hand our for more money and expect our gratuitude. Enough is enough.
Those who stand proud, full square, and staunchly behind the totally free and public health care system have one thing in common - they all have private health insuruace. It is not they who will suffer the consequences of their stance.
well our education and health is already 'private' so...
What does the Irish President spend their time doing. Work in progress
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Privatisation of health and education has nothing to do with Lisbon and everything to do with GATS. Article VI.4(b) of the GATS is what Harney is using to flog off whats left of the health service to for-profit corporations.
Fianna Fail - The Loss of Sovereignty Party.
I recently had a family member who needed a scan. In a public hospital we were told the wait would be four months - for a scan that takes 15 minutes????? We asked about and a private hospital (the Beacon I think) booked the scan within 48 hours at a cost of 150 euro!
Now it occours to me, am I am trying not to sound nasty, but when someone claims they or a family member got cancer or some other horrible illness because they had to wait 6 months etc for a scan, that in that peiod they could not have russeled up the cash to get it done privatly is beyond belief? They could not beg, steal or borrowed it? Under public private partnership the money could then at least be re-embursed. Under the public system there is no hope of even getting a timely diagnosis, yet alone an accurate one apparently.
That was a cheap scan.
I know somebody who told me recently that their mother was recommended for a scan in a public hospital. Because of the wait, she looked into getting it done privately. Cost was well over 1000 Euro.
This woman has only a part-time job and her husband is on illness benefits.
I do not think a private hospital system would by of much help to her.
Maybe getting treated for ************************ing cancer costs more than a 15 minute scan?No of course no one would doubt that the government is going down the road of privatising parts of the health service, but so what?
I recently had a family member who needed a scan. In a public hospital we were told the wait would be four months - for a scan that takes 15 minutes????? We asked about and a private hospital (the Beacon I think) booked the scan within 48 hours at a cost of 150 euro!
Now it occours to me, am I am trying not to sound nasty, but when someone claims they or a family member got cancer or some other horrible illness because they had to wait 6 months etc for a scan, that in that peiod they could not have russeled up the cash to get it done privatly is beyond belief? They could not beg, steal or borrowed it? Under public private partnership the money could then at least be re-embursed. Under the public system there is no hope of even getting a timely diagnosis, yet alone an accurate one apparently.
It seems it has become politically expedient for members of the oppostion, unions and the media to watch poor people die, without ever pointing out the bleeding obvious - that parts of our health service are beyond repair or saving and the model of free public health care (there is no such thing as free anyway) born in the middle of the last century, was never going to work as entirely as envisioned. It should not be abandoned, but neither should it be closed to change or evolution.
I am not in favour of privatising the health service, but the cold facts are many working in the public health service don't give a f**k about the patients they are supposed to care for. If private facilities can be paid for to deliver services at a fraction of the cost and time needed by public services, then so be it. Give them the money and the job - the public sector has proven nothing but a headache and incapable of doing the task. Our hospitals are not only inefficient, but filthy too. From top to bottom, minister, doctors, consulultants, nurses - all have failed and all still have their hand our for more money and expect our gratuitude. Enough is enough.
Those who stand proud, full square, and staunchly behind the totally free and public health care system have one thing in common - they all have private health insuruace. It is not they who will suffer the consequences of their stance.
Let them eat cake!
To live honestly, to hurt no one, to give every one his due.
Within 10 years "services" will be so devolved to the community we will have a situation where roaving witch doctors and trips to Lourdes/Knock/CrokePatrick account for the public health system.
The privatisation of the health system will end up with rich people travelling to the UK while the entire HSE dedicated to serving the governement TDs with a specialist wing for Mary Harney and the multitude of problems she will face having such disregard for her own personal health as she has for the people of Irelands.
Thank god there is no Abortion allowed in this country - can you imagine the 18 month waiting lists?
The early bird may get the worm - but the second mouse gets the cheese.
http://www.caeuc.org/index.php?q=node/226
It is quite clear the issue of privatisation and Lisbon isn't something that fell out of the sky like the abortion issue , the minister is lying out his teeth on this one . See above link for better info .
Freedom in capitalist society always remains about the same as it was in ancient Greek republics: Freedom for slave owners. For a Real Alternative :
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Yes but see Article 14 of the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union as amended by the Lisbon Treaty, which states:
Emphasis added.Without prejudice to Article 4 of the Treaty on European Union or to Articles 93, 106 and 107 of
this Treaty, and given the place occupied by services of general economic interest in the shared
values of the Union as well as their role in promoting social and territorial cohesion, the Union and
the Member States, each within their respective powers and within the scope of application of the
Treaties, shall take care that such services operate on the basis of principles and conditions,
particularly economic and financial conditions, which enable them to fulfil their missions. The
European Parliament and the Council, acting by means of regulations in accordance with the
ordinary legislative procedure, shall establish these principles and set these conditions without
prejudice to the competence of Member States, in compliance with the Treaties, to provide, to
commission and to fund such services.
Now, a public service would not be able to fulfil its mission, or indeed any kind of socially cohesive mission, if subject to a privatization. That is one of the main arguments against privatization. So, with that in mind, this Treaty may actually oblige member states to prop up public services and, if needs be, nationalize them. In any case it doesn't mandate their privatization.
To live honestly, to hurt no one, to give every one his due.
<Mod>Moved to the Fianna Fáil forum.</Mod>
Heavy words are so lightly thrown.
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