EU Army

[Grumpy Jack]

The de Havilland DH.100 Vampire was a British jet-engine fighter.

The Irish air corps possessed at least two and possibly three of these

I now that and I said that. The Vampires were the only 'jet fighters' operated the Air Corps. They were also pretty basic and were out of date by the time they entered Irish service. They dated from the 1950s and last flew operationally in 1976.

The afternoon of July 30, 1956, marked an important milestone in Irish aviation because it was then that the first Irish jet touched down at Baldonnel on the newly laid concrete runways. Three DH Vampire T-55 training aircraft were purchased to replace the Spitfires and the delivery flight from Hatfield, near London took a mere fifty minutes. The Jet age had arrived in Ireland. These were the first Irish jet aircraft to land in Ireland and they were to be followed by three more vampires. The last Vampire to fly V191 was on 3 March 1976.

The new jet could fly higher and faster and the Vampires’ armament of rockets, bombs and four formidable 20mm cannons ensured that training did not remain the only role. Another three jets arrived in 1961 to complete the reequipping of fighter squadron. These six were the only air corps aircraft to be equipped with ejection seats and fortunately this safety measure was used only once.

Defence Forces - Air Corps - History

My point still stands. The Air Corps does not possess 'fighter jets'. And it is highly unlikely they ever will.

[The Field Marshal]

I now that and I said that. The Vampires were the only 'jet fighters' operated the Air Corps. They were also pretty basic and were out of date by the time they entered Irish service. They dated from the 1950s and last flew operationally in 1976.



Defence Forces - Air Corps - History

My point still stands. The Air Corps does not possess 'fighter jets'. And it is highly unlikely they ever will.

Im not disputing your basic point.

However these jets [vampire] are fighter jets and currently as far as I know still in the possession of the Air Corps [albeit retired] and probably capable of being made operational.

Im not advocating this merely pointing out that it is not strictly correct to state that the Air Corps did not possess fighter jets .

[Grumpy Jack]

Im not disputing your basic point.

However these jets [vampire] are fighter jets and currently as far as I know still in the possession of the Air Corps [albeit retired] and probably capable of being made operational.

Im not advocating this merely pointing out that it is not strictly correct to state that the Air Corps did not possess fighter jets .

Are you Field Marshal Walter Mitty?

Don't be ridiculous. One is in the National Museum. The rest are long gone. They cannot be made operational. Those planes were built in the 1950s - where the hell are they gonna get the spare parts for them to make it/them fly again? www.vintagejetspares.com?

By your logic they should try and make the Hurricanes and Spitfires used during The Emergency and the post-war years operational again.

Again, the Air Corps DO (present tense) NOT have fighter jets. That is strictly correct. Having a few obselete aircraft in 1960s and 1970s does not mean they exist to day in a hangar at Baldonnel.

It is precisely this reason I am pointing this out.

The loons on P.ie will see some idiot say 'Ireland has a couple of fighter jets' and then start spouting about a top secret conspiracy by 'the elites' to arm us to the teeth to join the vast EU Army that's about to declare war on Iran, China and anyone else who says boo to Brussels.

[The Field Marshal]

Are you Field Marshal Walter Mitty?

Don't be ridiculous. One is in the National Museum. The rest are long gone. They cannot be made operational. Those planes were built in the 1950s - where the hell are they gonna get the spare parts for them to make it/them fly again? www.vintagejetspares.com?

By your logic they should try and make the Hurricanes and Spitfires used during The Emergency and the post-war years operational again.

Again, the Air Corps DO (present tense) NOT have fighter jets. That is strictly correct. Having a few obselete aircraft in 1960s and 1970s does not mean they exist to day in a hangar at Baldonnel.

It is precisely this reason I am pointing this out.

The loons on P.ie will see some idiot say 'Ireland has a couple of fighter jets' and then start spouting about a top secret conspiracy by 'the elites' to arm us to the teeth to join the vast EU Army that's about to declare war on Iran, China and anyone else who says boo to Brussels.

Your beginning to sound like pedantic general George Lee.Relax.

[In a doomsday situation the jet in the museum could be made operational.]


If the Air Corps currently needs upgrading I support that.

[Contrary to your wild assertions I do not advocate re-activation of any out of date military hardware].

Get a grip man.

[Grumpy Jack]

Your beginning to sound like pedantic general George Lee.Relax.

[In a doomsday situation the jet in the museum could be made operational.]


If the Air Corps currently needs upgrading I support that.

[Contrary to your wild assertions I do not advocate re-activation of any out of date military hardware].

Get a grip man.

In a 'doomsday' situation the Vampire in the museum cannot be made operational. It has been stripped clean. It is an airframe hanging from the ceiling.

I agree with you on the Air Corps needing upgrading. But it needs medium lift helicopters in the Cougar/NH90/Mi17/AW101 class and transport aircraft, either C130 Hercules or CASA C295s to support troops on UN missions - not fighter aircraft that will look good on the ramp but that we can't afford to send into the air.

To give you an idea of how much these things cost, Air Forces Monthly, a well-respected military aviation magazine, recently did a feature on the Austrian Air Force - a fellow EU neutral like our good selves.

The Austrians spent close to €2 billion buying 15 Eurofighter Typhoons after reducing the original order from 24 to 18 to 15 due to rising costs and budget constraints and massive resistance in the country to such military expenditure.

AFM reported that the annual operating cost of the 15 Austrian Typhoons at £60 million sterling - close to €70m at current exchange rates.

To put that into perspective, that's more than the entire 2010 budget for equipment purchases and operational costs for the Defence Forces.

Ireland cannot afford expensive - to buy and operate - military equipment. It's not going to happen. The best the DF can expect is new patrol vessels for the Naval Service to replace its oldest ships and, maybe, medium lift helicopters, but delayed for years due to the fiscal mess we are in.

[The Fusilier]

Ya just want te get yer gurrier kick in.Dya feel better now?

The jets owned by the air corps [the Fouga] are fighter jets.

Irish troops were attacked by such a jet in the Battle of Jadoville

They could carry bombs and be fitted with machine guns.

As a common Fusilier you should have basic knowledge of military matters.

You clearly dont.

Do a George Lee immediately.

Your statement.

Sondagefaux


The Air Corps do have fighter jets.

Your grammar is getting as bad as your knowledge of defence issues.

Your position as a forum poster is untenable, Air Marshal.

[He3]

from the link on post #46 the German government reckons it is time for us to put our hand in our pocket and pay for this enterprise:

He said however that this would require a pooling of resources and distribution of responsibility "even in times of ever scarcer means."

He reckons we voted our way into this -

The concept of a European army was set out in the 27-nation EU's reforming Lisbon Treaty," he said.

[FutureTaoiseach]

from the link on post #46 the German government reckons it is time for us to put our hand in our pocket and pay for this enterprise:



He reckons we voted our way into this -

He's obviously forgotten the French and Dutch.

[Grumpy Jack]

from the link on post #46 the German government reckons it is time for us to put our hand in our pocket and pay for this enterprise:



He reckons we voted our way into this -

Put our hands in our pockets and pull out what? All they'll find is fresh air and the lining. We are skint. We will be skint for the next decade at least.

We cannot afford to upgrade the Defence Forces. We have little to offer any 'EU Army'.

This is just the usual paranoia that this site is known for.

And in case you hadn't noticed, defence budgets across the EU are being slashed.

FFS, the Brits are so skint they are talking about axing the RAF and merging its downgraded assets into the Army and Royal Navy. They are talking of slashing its planned F35 Lightening II (a real 'fighter jet') purchase from 150 to 60 and axing Harrier and Tornado squadrons to pay for Afghanistan war.

The defence budgets of the Germans, French, Italians and Spanish - the four other big military players in the EU - are all under serious pressure.

The middle players like the Dutch and Swedes have also cut their defence budgets in recent years, as have all the smaller states.

Just because some senior EU politician suggests something doesn't mean it is going to happen. Whether it is defence,tax matters or abortion, as soon as some EU head suggests something people here don't like, the wingnuts on this site go into overdrive and start posting as if it is a fait accompli.

Once again, defence, and for that matter taxation, require unanimity. We have a veto. Nothing happens without our say so.

On defence, we can say: "Go ahead lads if you want to but the only defence we care about is the one we've been sitting on for the last 70 years. Good luck with it all."

[He3]

...

This is just the usual paranoia that this site is known for.

Quoting a policy statement by a German Minister of relevance to Ireland is 'paranoia' you think?

Gesundheit.