EU economic growth outrunning US

[ibis]

Well, we're all due to hit a glitch over the next century, in the shape of global warming.

I too would prefer to see Europe remain uncomfortably on top, but I don't know whether such a thing is possible. As human capital becomes more important than manufacturing muscle, it's hard to see how Europe can outweigh countries of a billion plus.

Having said that, I think the hard bits of the Indian and Chinese roads are ahead. Neither have an entrepreneurial mindset at the governing levels. China has a long history of setting back reform when it becomes too much like freedom. India has a history of tangling itself in pointless red tape, plus as a democracy, it will have to share the wealth about.

Personally, I will settle for the EU being heavy-weight and well-armed enough to sit like the grumpy middle-aged biker in the corner of the bar while the young guys try out their muscle on each other.

However, more R&D, better basic education, more entrepreneurship, all good - several European countries make it extremely difficult to be entrepreneurial.

[AFJROTC Cadet]

If an american company produces 5 billion euros worth of stuff in Europe does that count towards Europes GDP?

[St Disibod]

Personally, I will settle for the EU being heavy-weight and well-armed enough to sit like the grumpy middle-aged biker in the corner of the bar while the young guys try out their muscle on each other.

I like the analogy, but if I were to elaborate:

You could say Europe is sitting in Uncle Sam's bar.* What happens when Uncle Sam decides the young guys are better customers? We'll quickly lose our place at the bar, no?

At the moment we have the potential to buy the bar, we just need to realise it.

*- I suppose it's all a matter of perspective. To what degree does the international economic system run of its own accord- placing us all in the one bar, at varying distances from the taps? And to what degree is the international economic system in the control of states- giving certain states ownership of the bar? With Doha stalled and Russian Gas companies (read the Kremlin) reaching with their bear-like paws for Europe's nether regions, there's still a heavy dollop of the latter at play.

[ibis]

Personally, I will settle for the EU being heavy-weight and well-armed enough to sit like the grumpy middle-aged biker in the corner of the bar while the young guys try out their muscle on each other.

I like the analogy, but if I were to elaborate:

You could say Europe is sitting in Uncle Sam's bar.* What happens when Uncle Sam decides the young guys are better customers? We'll quickly lose our place at the bar, no?

It would be slightly closer to the truth to say that Uncle Sam is the town's rich alcoholic. That's not really defamation - currently, the US is the world's major consuming economy, which is a fairly standard thing for an imperial centre.

At the moment we have the potential to buy the bar, we just need to realise it.

At the moment we are buying the bar, a bit at a time. Europeans invest heavily in the US, buying bits of US companies - we also buy a lot of things in other places.

*- I suppose it's all a matter of perspective. To what degree does the international economic system run of its own accord- placing us all in the one bar, at varying distances from the taps? And to what degree is the international economic system in the control of states- giving certain states ownership of the bar? With Doha stalled and Russian Gas companies (read the Kremlin) reaching with their bear-like paws for Europe's nether regions, there's still a heavy dollop of the latter at play.

No country has ever 'owned the bar'. Even at its height, the British Empire never felt better than 'somewhat ahead' of Russia, Germany, and France - militarily and diplomatically. Economically, who can say? The world economy is now so immensely complex and interlocked that there is, I think, simply no analogy for it but itself.

Yes, the Russians have a lot of oil and gas - so does the Middle East. By taking on previously Eastern Bloc countries, we have inherited their deliberate dependence on Russia. Because of the American destabilisation of the Middle East, we have been pushed into greater dependence on Russia.

Nothing lasts, and if the world in 100 years is as different from this one as this one is from that of 1906, then it is impossible to predict what threats and opportunities we face. We can do the best we can, and I would be very surprised if we are not able to fight our corner.

[AFJROTC Cadet]

Im going to start buying bits of European companies