Spiritofireland.org - suggests energy independence in five years and much more

[realist]

how can I comment on specific projections except in a general sense, until the sites are chosen and the government and people decide what level of energy independence is desired, only then can a business plan and financial projections be produced

So until the parameters of the project are finalised I can only comment on or argue concepts and their practicalities, not specific financial projections. And every S of I presentation to date has been on that basis.

The video presentation to the IIEA clearly showed the potential sites that SOI had chosen. It also gave gave preliminary financial projections. In fact the link that you provided yesterday has a post from someone called James (who also signs off as Graham....) who seems to be very close to the project. He says:

"I asked them what they expected the power price to be. They responded “7-8 cents per kW hour fixed for 10 years with discounts to large users”. “The price would then decline to “5-6 cents per kW hour once capital is paid down.”

So, those are the figures SOI are working on it appears. Thanks for the link.

The Irish Economy Blog Archive The Spirit of Ireland

[fiannafailure]

The video presentation to the IIEA clearly showed the potential sites that SOI had chosen. It also gave gave preliminary financial projections. In fact the link that you provided yesterday has a post from someone called James (who also signs off as Graham....) who seems to be very close to the project. He says:

"I asked them what they expected the power price to be. They responded “7-8 cents per kW hour fixed for 10 years with discounts to large users”. “The price would then decline to “5-6 cents per kW hour once capital is paid down.”

So, those are the figures SOI are working on it appears. Thanks for the link.

The Irish Economy Blog Archive The Spirit of Ireland

Realist
Other than to highlight the words preliminary financial projections, I would have nothing to argue about your post

[fiannafailure]

Riven,
I would only have a comment on

And the value of these activities are? And I could equally argue that the vally is alreadfy recreational and that becuase scrub and grassland take up more C02 than water resevoirs that I am loosing money.

Actually where most of S of I environmental effort is being concentrated on at the moment, is the fact that active bogs absorb six times more co2 than grass or trees, and S of I or indeed activity from any quarter on the west coast must include this fact into their plans.

And the word value should have a wider context than money.

[sparkey321]

Realist
Other than to highlight the words preliminary financial projections, I would have nothing to argue about your post

But you have to accept that a figure of 7 to 8 cent per KW hour (assuming wholesale) would come no where near covering the cost of the project unless the reservoirs are scaled up dramatically which would also drive up the cost further.

You also have to admit hat a price of 7 to 8 cent or €70 to €80 would rule out exports and have a significant impact on electricity costs in Ireland. Rather than bringing prices down as SOI claim they would actually increase prices.

[fiannafailure]

But you have to accept that a figure of 7 to 8 cent per KW hour (assuming wholesale) would come no where near covering the cost of the project unless the reservoirs are scaled up dramatically which would also drive up the cost further.

You also have to admit hat a price of 7 to 8 cent or €70 to €80 would rule out exports and have a significant impact on electricity costs in Ireland. Rather than bringing prices down as SOI claim they would actually increase prices.

That's if you have a decision on the payback time of your capital, you seem to be intent on ten years but a ten year old hydro unit is not even out of nappies

[fiannafailure]

Riven

Yes I am the amount of material you are using would be huge on the scale of a small strip mine. And you would have to build the biggest PSH for salt water application by a long way as well. If it is so simple why is there only one in the world?

About ten to fifteen thousand cubic metres of earth and rock, depending on the site and capacity specified, about the amount of groundworks attached to building thirty or forty miles of motorway.

Some people say why dont you build small at first, and learn, then build big.
Or you could ask the people who already built small to help with the big one, they are the only experts in the world now, but in five years time... are you listening ESB international, but then I know you are.

[sparkey321]

That's if you have a decision on the payback time of your capital, you seem to be intent on ten years but a ten year old hydro unit is not even out of nappies

(Are you sure you watched the presentation because you are contradicting alot of it ?)


The presentation clearly stated a 10 year payback. Its and SOI figure not mine (if you remember I used 20 years in my earlier calculations)

Once again.

Of the 11.4 billion only a fraction is being spent on the Hydro plant. So minimal effect on pricing.

Bearing all this in mind can you now accept that perhaps this is not as clear cut as you may have thought ? That SOI may not actually have the solution to the problem ?

[fiannafailure]

(Are you sure you watched the presentation because you are contradicting alot of it ?)


The presentation clearly stated a 10 year payback. Its and SOI figure not mine (if you remember I used 20 years in my earlier calculations)

Once again.

Of the 11.4 billion only a fraction is being spent on the Hydro plant. So minimal effect on pricing.

Bearing all this in mind can you now accept that perhaps this is not as clear cut as you may have thought ? That SOI may not actually have the solution to the problem ?

Sparkey

S of I have A solution to the problem which also has a positive bearing on many other problems in the country. I look forward to seeing others if the country says on your bike, I would however see the only major difference being private or public funding. As regards presentations they really are only conceptual at present and you are being hunted at the moment to work on the actual business plan.

[sparkey321]

Sparkey

S of I have A solution to the problem which also has a positive bearing on many other problems in the country. I look forward to seeing others if the country says on your bike, I would however see the only major difference being private or public funding. As regards presentations they really are only conceptual at present and you are being hunted at the moment to work on the actual business plan.

Now you are contradicting SOI again. They have stated that the costings are complete (its even in the presentation).

Costings for wind-farms is not difficult and SOI are using the industry standard model. It may be out a couple of percent but not much.

Have you changed you mind about the straight jacket and are you now saying that ti should proceed no matter the costs of the electricity produced ?

Will you accept the possibility that SOI proposal may not be the solution ? Even the possibility ?

[fiannafailure]

Now you are contradicting SOI again. They have stated that the costings are complete (its even in the presentation).

Costings for wind-farms is not difficult and SOI are using the industry standard model. It may be out a couple of percent but not much.

Have you changed you mind about the straight jacket and are you now saying that ti should proceed no matter the costs of the electricity produced ?

Will you accept the possibility that SOI proposal may not be the solution ? Even the possibility ?

If the costings are complete and after reading my last three or four posts you can still argue on figures as other than for discussion yes I think I will contemplate the strait jacket... but hold on I must compute the effect this contemplation will have financially for the next 10 years

c u soonish