Spiritofireland.org - suggests energy independence in five years and much more

[riven]

Riven,
I would have thought you could have seen the irony in my original post on the subject, my point was that we can make our own "oil" instead of importing the real stuff and making the Saudi's even richer and Ireland poorer. Nothing miraculous like turning water into wine, merely off the shelf engineering

And you cant expect to discuss ongoing commercial negotiations, other than to state the plant I provided the link for is profitable.

Really off the shelf engineering. Your having a laugh. There is not one engineer that would consider such a project off the shelf. That is an insult to my profession.

Furthermore we have one salt water PSH in the world. Please redefine your off the shelf definition.

And you still have not explained the term profit value for water and refuted my arguements (that are backed up I may add) that using salt water would make the system more expensive.

Oil into water: alchemy I tells ya

[fiannafailure]

Really off the shelf engineering. Your having a laugh. There is not one engineer that would consider such a project off the shelf. That is an insult to my profession.

What particular aspect would you consider difficult

Furthermore we have one salt water PSH in the world. Please redefine your off the shelf definition.

Yes I suppose you are correct, S of I version is even simpler, nature has done most of the work

And you still have not explained the term profit value for water and refuted my arguements (that are backed up I may add) that using salt water would make the system more expensive.

Easily provisioned by the cheaper civil engineering

Oil into water: alchemy I tells ya

Cant Help That

[sparkey321]

sparkey
even if it is €145 per MWh
that works out at 15c a kWh. which is less than the current ESB rate even before you consider standing charges.

PS i've no idea where that figure came from and what it does or doesn't account for

that's 15 cents in the reservoir. Then you need to add generation costs (to turn water into electricity) You need to add transmission costs (there is obviously a charge for using the grid, maintenance, depreciation, meter reading etc. Then you need to add profit margin, admin costs (billing customer service etc) etc etc etc...

[sparkey321]

Sparkey


Explanation in my above post, but you reminded me, I have to add S of i profit to the value of the water in the reservoir, say 2 cents Kw/Hr the water is worth €70,000.

Errrr no..

That's 15 cents in the reservoir..........

Long way from reservoir to usable electricity in the home, Lots and lots of extra costs see my post above.

You really really should think before answering, makes you look foolish....

[sparkey321]

€148 is apparently mentioned somewhere on S of I website, I didn't bother looking as it is a non runner unless it is a retail price, and I have no interest in it unless it is retail

5c = €50 per MW is the target set by S of I for wholesale wind power at the end of 5 years activity. And is an informed target, but if S of I can only manage to get it to €70/ Mw, I would be happy.

€55 is the average off peak european wholesale price, the peak price is I believe €85

Is clarity restored

So you are standing over €50 per MW Hour ?

Say €70 max ??

Before I answer you need to be 100% sure because I don't want you changing your mind later after I go to the bother of posting...

Do you want to look at the presentation again ? Do you want to look at what the revenue figures will be based on these new figures ? Do you want to look at the costs and payback periods ?

Tell you what I will leave it until tomorrow before I answer just in case you want to change your mind.

I don't want you looking foolish again.......

[fiannafailure]

So you are standing over €50 per MW Hour ?

Say €70 max ??

Before I answer you need to be 100% sure because I don't want you changing your mind later after I go to the bother of posting...

Do you want to look at the presentation again ? Do you want to look at what the revenue figures will be based on these new figures ? Do you want to look at the costs and payback periods ?

Tell you what I will leave it until tomorrow before I answer just in case you want to change your mind.

I don't want you looking foolish again.......

Sparkey,

Snake oil salesmen can never be afraid of looking foolish, when there are snipers hiding in the long grass, taking pot shots at targets of opportunity. I am resigned to not seeing my girlfriend or wife again, or at least until I could be bothered to put together a 10 or 20 page summary just for you. By the way the next scheduled presentation may be in jeopardy, as it has been so oversubscribed that a big enough venue is now being searched for, and it wasn't anybody from S of I who told me that, this snake oil business is great.

And please read the words that went with those figures. Wholesale off peak sales value.

[fiannafailure]

that's 15 cents in the reservoir. Then you need to add generation costs (to turn water into electricity) You need to add transmission costs (there is obviously a charge for using the grid, maintenance, depreciation, meter reading etc. Then you need to add profit margin, admin costs (billing customer service etc) etc etc etc...

Sparkey
I wasn't aware that S of I had decided to go into the retail end of the business, but I have been talking to you for so long anything is possible, so take what, 10% to cover generation and misc. S of I propose to own some of the grid as a TAO so can give themselves a bit of a deal and sure if push comes to shove, luckily at this stage we are only talking, when the business plan is published, we can really have a go at each other

[fiannafailure]

Errrr no..

That's 15 cents in the reservoir..........

Long way from reservoir to usable electricity in the home, Lots and lots of extra costs see my post above.

You really really should think before answering, makes you look foolish....

Apply that logic to the coal yards at Moneypoint, it didn't seem to put ESB off building that huge edifice

[fiannafailure]

See Richard Tol has found a new admirer.

Richard,
I first corresponded with you some time ago, near the top of this,….words fail me… this blog in which I questioned your integrity. I decided to wait a while before making my judgement on you and may I say, I would not dare to be harsh or unkind enough to comment as I intend to, on a private citizen expressing their views on any subject, but you are expressing your views from the towering heights of the ESRI and so I feel no remorse in describing you as a damned disgrace, who patently is in love with his celebrity and has the undying love of Veronica, who I suspect may have an incestuous literary relationship to you. And who displays the same lack of engineering knowledge as yourself and an equal disdain for the economic reality faced by the people of this country. That Richard is only the beginning of my interest in you and I intend to be a regular correspondent in the future, and I will force some knowledge of S of I into you and your organisation, and Richard it will be free of charge.

The Irish Economy Blog Archive The Spirit of Ireland

[riven]

What particular aspect would you consider difficult
Yes I suppose you are correct, S of I version is even simpler, nature has done most of the work

You are having a laugh right; what part wopuld you consider difficult? SOI will be building the biggest turbine pump operation in the world for a saltwater application for one. Jesus. What part do you think is easy?

And the SOI version is evne simplier? No it is much more complicated as it is maybe ten times bigger.

Easily provisioned by the cheaper civil engineering

So we have gone from profit valve for water to oil to cheaper engineering. Come on explain your original term clearly