Spiritofireland.org - suggests energy independence in five years and much more

[SirCharles]

You were the one ranting and raging that we should seize the gas field, not me.

And I was answering your question.

[SirCharles]

Is this the same Donegal where some wind farms are sturggling to reach wind capacity factors of 8-9% so far this year?

Even with pumped storage, how the heck would enough power have been generated the remaining 90% of the time.

Can people not actually see this problem? Do they not realise how large the pumped storage facilities need to be to overcome this?
The figures are mind-boggling.
This is the problem with wind. You can get times where the wind will blow all day every day for weeks and then you can be left for weeks at a time where there is barely a puff of wind at all.

This is where you need ridiculously large storage facilities.
Facilities with enough water stored to possibly supply the majority of the country with enough energy for a couple of months.

Now have a look at Turlough Hill.
That supplies 292MW for a few hours.
Look at the size of it.

Now, how many Turlough Hills are needed to supply the whole country with electricity for two months?

Donegal's wind energy output lies at 225 MegaWatts, ten times more than Wicklow or Mayo, for instance which are just as windy.

I agree that we need more than just wind energy to produce sustainable, carbon neutral electricity.

Therefore you can not rely on one single technic.
A combination of wind and tide as source with a storage for hikes and lows would be the answer.

Anyhow here a new article in the IT => Seawater energy proposal for Mayo - The Irish Times - Wed, Mar 03, 2010

Only saying 'nay' doesn't help us any further.

[Heorditas]

Donegal's wind energy output lies at 225 MegaWatts, ten times more than Wicklow or Mayo, for instance which are just as windy.

You didn't understand what I posted, did you?

[feargach]

That's loony.

Even the slower fossil fuel based power plants can be up and running in 12 hours. Meaning we only need enough pumped storage for 12 windless hours, after which we can keep burning carbon until the wind comes back.

Indeed, if it is managed well, we could have plants burning only Irish wood on those occasions when there is no wind. Thus no need to import hydrocarbons for electrical generation.

[joel]

That's loony.

Even the slower fossil fuel based power plants can be up and running in 12 hours. Meaning we only need enough pumped storage for 12 windless hours, after which we can keep burning carbon until the wind comes back.

Indeed, if it is managed well, we could have plants burning only Irish wood on those occasions when there is no wind. Thus no need to import hydrocarbons for electrical generation.

Of course - but, in order to make a point, he gives a worst case senario. Witless.

[energy]

Indeed, if it is managed well, we could have plants burning only Irish wood on those occasions when there is no wind.

Are you being serious here ?

The tiny Wilton 10 (Wood Burning Power Station at Wilton 10 - Power Technology) 30MW plant in the UK consumes 300,000t of wood per year !

[SAT]

Are you being serious here ?

The tiny Wilton 10 (Wood Burning Power Station at Wilton 10 - Power Technology) 30MW plant in the UK consumes 300,000t of wood per year !

I did a double take on that too. If Feargach had his way we would deforest Ireland in a week

[windmeup]

Sustainabilty magazine: the practical journal for green building, renewable energy, permaculture and sustainable communities calculated that it would take three Lough Neaghs suspended at 200 metres above sea level to provide enough hydro power to run Ireland for a month, and he was being conservative !
The amount of energy contained in a gallon of petrol is equivalent to the energy produced by three men digging a hole for a month [ they get food and toilet breaks SirCharles, so don`t get up on a rant over this! ]

[windmeup]

Sustainability has a very good analysis of SOI under the heading Greenspin on their site
We are living in a fools paradise, with regard to energy----I mentioned the petrol versus men working just to give a simple illustration of the mind boggling amount of energy contained in fossil fuels.
The other trouble with alternative energy is that it takes huge amounts of energy [fossil fuel] to build and install wind and wave/tidal devices----I reckon that it could take up to 4 years to repay the energy used to build a wind turbine [embodied energy ] running in Ireland, and up to 8 years in Germany, so combined with the energy to keep it serviced and repaired, one would not have a very sound economic return on ones investment, either in cash or energy.
SOI reservoirs would have to be at 100M above sea level not 200M as I stated in my last post.

[wombat]

I did a double take on that too. If Feargach had his way we would deforest Ireland in a week

I actually looked at a wood fired steam boiler for a factory a few years ago. Not only did it not make economic sense, we would have displaced a large portion of the fuel oil saved with diesel to haul the wood. They're fine in a sawmill but unless you have a convenient large forest, they're not too practical.