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  1. #41181
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    I just love Mark Steyne's sharp wit. His observations on the Bengtsson affair is a wonderful read:

    Bengtsson Burners :: SteynOnline

    As a past arts critis, he does such an excellent line in theatrical or musical allusion:

    I've lately been meeting with potential witnesses for my end of the upcoming Mann vs Steyn trial. And I always tell them the same thing: They don't have to do this, and I wouldn't think any less of them if they declined, but, if they decide to go ahead and testify for the defense, they must understand that the ayatollahs of alarmism will get out the hockey sticks and club them to a pulp, as they've just done to Professor Bengtsson. Most of them are firm in their commitment to stand up for the truth - but in a climate mob trial there's no witness protection program, alas.



    That milieu seems more apt than the "Climate McCarthyism" thing, I'd say. A few weeks ago, I compared Michael Mann to Brando in The Godfather: He's the Warmfather whose tree ring you have to kiss. But, with hindsight, Brando-wise, Mann's more like Lee J Cobb in On The Warmerfront: a palooka like Mike Hulme don't know that when they come around asking whether you know anything about Johnny Tree-Rings and his hockey stick, a smart guy plays d-&-d, right?
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  2. #41182
    Earthling Earthling is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glanshanacuirp View Post
    How much would all the World need to reduce CO2 output to avoid Climate change?
    If the output of CO2 was reduced to zero, climate change would not be avoided.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glanshanacuirp View Post
    Is Climate change inevitable?
    Yes, it always has been.

    Quote Originally Posted by Glanshanacuirp View Post
    Will measures merely delay Climate change?
    Highly unlikely.

    NB: Climate isn't a proper noun, therefore doesn't need a capital C unless it begins a sentence.
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  3. #41183
    Volatire Volatire is offline
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    Pseudo-science, witch-hunts, lies, propaganda, denouncements, intimidation, charlatan ism, rabble-rousing, technological fetishes, conspiracy theories, persecution complexes.

    No, this isn't 1930s Germany.

    This is Climate Activism. Today.
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  4. #41184
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    Estimated total global annual income = $70 trillion.

    So you are saying we have suffered an 11% fall in our income globally? I think I am safe in saying we haven't noticed such a massive loss of welfare.

    Think about that. In Ireland we suffered a fall in national income of 11% almost exactly between 2007 and 2010, when it stabilised.


    Our recession "cost" us 11% of our national income and it certainly didn't happen witohut us noticing. Uneployment went up from 5% to 15%. Bankruptcy exploded, companies across the country went bust, house prices plummeted.

    That is what "costing 11% of you income" feels like.
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  5. #41185
    valamhic valamhic is offline

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  6. #41186
    valamhic valamhic is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trainwreck View Post
    Estimated total global annual income = $70 trillion.

    So you are saying we have suffered an 11% fall in our income globally? I think I am safe in saying we haven't noticed such a massive loss of welfare.

    Think about that. In Ireland we suffered a fall in national income of 11% almost exactly between 2007 and 2010, when it stabilised.


    Our recession "cost" us 11% of our national income and it certainly didn't happen witohut us noticing. Uneployment went up from 5% to 15%. Bankruptcy exploded, companies across the country went bust, house prices plummeted.

    That is what "costing 11% of you income" feels like.
    It costs me 59 euros on a ton of coal
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  7. #41187
    Glanshanacuirp Glanshanacuirp is offline

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    What percentage of our economic output does Animal based Irish Agriculture generate ?
    I am sure it is a lot less than 30%
    If this output was utilised in other areas of production I am sure that a greater economic return could be made.
    Should we return to rationing meat and dairy products to avoid excess consumption for the sake of the Environment?
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  8. #41188
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by valamhic View Post
    It costs me 59 euros on a ton of coal
    Quite.

    Mitigating "climate change" is costing us billions, possibly tens of billions.

    Climate change itself is costing us nothing.
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  9. #41189
    Trainwreck Trainwreck is offline

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    I have to keep coming back to Barry's big survey.

    So far, we have found out that 11,944 peer reviewed papers that "overwhelmingly endorse the consensus" actually comprises only 64 papers that might endorse the consensus. (and 9 that explicitly reject the consensus).

    That made m curious enough to dig into the detail a bit more.


    These 64 papers that "explicitly endorse AGW aznd qunatify the effect as >50%" must be papers that research the atmospheric physics ofthe planet, using lots of data on temperature, CO2 etc. in order to quntify the changes in temperatures and to quantify and attribute the causes of the changes.

    Here are the titles of some of the papers that were judged to "explicitly endorse AGW aznd qunatify the effect as >50%". See if you think they will contain the required research, data and analysis to support there classification of "endorsing the consensus"

    Banagrass Vs Eucalyptus Wood As Feedstocks For Metallurgical Biocarbon Production
    A Model For The Co2 Capture Potential
    Study On Co2 Recovery System From Flue Gas By Honeycomb Type Adsorbent I - (results Of Tests And Simulation)
    Cfc And Halon Replacements In The Environment
    Leaf Carbon Assimilation In A Water-limited World
    Climate Policy Architectures For The Post-kyoto World
    The Potential Of Water Power In The Fight Against Global Warming In The US
    A Novel Formulation Of Carbon Emissions Costs For Optimal Design Configuration Of System Transmission Planning
    Conceptual Design And Simulation Analysis Of Thermal Behaviors Of Tgr Blast Furnace And Oxygen Blast Furnace

    I could go on. And on and on, but I think you get the point.

    I am going to go out on a limb and suggest these papers that are claimed to "support the consensus" by "explicitly endorsing and quantifying AGW as >50%" do so by simply making an unsupported statement, like "the IPCC says....." and then use that as their assumption or premise on which they build their own paper, which is actually about poicy design or windfarm technologies or somesuch.


    Poptechs impressive and well documented list is looking increasingly impressive to me, stacked up against what appears to be almost NO peer reviewed proof that AGW is causing even 50% of the measured warming.
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  10. #41190
    Steve Case Steve Case is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by barry schwarz View Post

    Poptech, do you reject the notion of warming from greenhouse gases accumulating in the atmosphere?
    Has a familiar ring to it:

    Are you now or have you ever been ...
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