€10 billion white elephant for Christmas - is it too late to stop this waste?

[Cut Once]

Is anyone aware of an increased burden of over €10 billion that is about to be volunteered onto the Irish electricity customer for absolutely no benefit whatsoever? I refer to the Renewable Energy Feed-in Tariff (REFIT) for Offshore Wind electricity that the Minister for Energy recently promised to introduce to Cabinet once Budget 2011 is out of the way. Minister makes pledge on renewable energy - The Irish Times - Wed, Nov 16, 2011

The ESRI has this to say on the matter: “In general, if off-shore wind is deployed widely, its costs are going to be high for the Irish consumer. At the same time, it appears unlikely that the electricity system will be able to accommodate much additional off-shore wind at low cost. There has been much discussion recently of developing Ireland’s off-shore electricity resources for export. This may well be optimal from a European (and specifically UK) point of view, if it is cheaper to develop these resources in Ireland than in the UK. However, it is clear that Irish consumers should not be called to fund and guarantee this business venture.” http://www.esri.ie/UserFiles/publications/WP374/WP374.pdf

It can be shown simply and clearly how the estimated EXTRA cost of the REFIT for offshore wind will be over €10 billion. ESRI estimate the increase in industrial electricity prices to be as high as 13.7%, even ignoring the extra cost of cabling and infrastructural costs, which are expected to be high.

Zero benefit. Greenhouse gas emissions are increasing faster than the worst case scenario considered by the IPCC (Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change) and so there will be a clamour by the Renewables industry to increase the use of their product. But Ireland has more than enough potential in onshore wind energy to generate our target of 40% of electricity from Renewables by 2020, so we don’t need the offshore wind capability for our purposes. Offshore wind is not a gram cleaner than onshore wind but is considerably more expensive.

The graph below (from the Sustainable Energy Authority of Ireland) shows offshore wind can cost up to 6 times as much as onshore wind as a means of displacing CO2.

EirGrid report that getting 40% of our electricity from Wind energy is “extremely challenging” (euphemism for "impractable") with our current generating plant. And even if we met the target, our greenhouse gas emissions from electricity would drop by only around 7%.

Which TDs have the technical or engineering training to enable them to grasp this issue quickly, if at all? Is there anyone that can actually make a difference to our economy by eliminating unnecessary expense – in this case to the tune of tens of billions of euro?

The position outlined above is backed up by data from the ESRI, the SEAI and EirGrid, and is supported by the Irish Academy of Engineering (a high level group within Engineers Ireland) and an increasing number of technical and engineering professionals in Ireland.

Many people support renewable energy, but I wonder does their support extend to the spending of a totally unnecessary €10 billion?

[Pat Gill]

Cut Once,

I believe that what is being discussed between Pat Rabbitte and Charles Hendry is a proposal to pay UK Renewable Obliglation Certificates to Irish wind farms for electricity to be exported to the UK.

This was discussed on the Right Hook on Newstalk some weeks ago.

I will post statements from the two Ministers later tonight.

[Socratus O' Pericles]

Offshore Wind Energy vs Onshore Wind Power – Advantages and Disadvantages | Green World Investor

Well these guys seem to have a different view but then they would wouldn't they? according to then offshore wind has solved all the problems and is the cheap next big thing.The Government gambling taxpayers money on a vested interest .....who wouldda thunk?

[Pat Gill]

Cut Once,

The energy ministers of the UK and Ireland addressed the NOW Ireland conference in Dublin on the 15th of Nov.

Here are the highlights of Pat Rabbittes speech.

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]I very much welcome our well established and flourishing cooperation between the UK and Ireland on all energy policy areas and in developing shared opportunities in renewable energy resources in particular. I look forward to moving that agenda ahead and with the objective of successfully arriving at quite a formal inter-Governmental Agreement using the co-operation mechanisms in the Renewable Energy Directive which will enable these islands to be among the first Member States to engage in cross border renewable energy trade to the mutual benefit of our economies. An export opportunity for Ireland can once again be an import opportunity for UK. This can indeed be a win/win for both our countries and for the industry players present here today. Let’s work together to make it happen in a way which delivers a fair economic and commercial return for all. [/FONT]


NOW Ireland Conference Tuesday 15 November 2011 - Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources

And highlights of Mr Hendrys speech at the same conference.

I’d like to start by recognising Ireland’s strong recent growth in renewables, and particularly your expertise in harnessing your abundant wind energy resources.


Over the next decade around a quarter of the UK’s existing generating capacity will close, and an estimated £110 billion investment in electricity generation and transmission is likely to be required by 2020, more than double the current rate of investment.


While the UK is looking to meet our 2020 renewables target domestically, the Roadmap mentions that the UK will look to ensure we have the powers to both import and export renewables through the use of the flexibility mechanisms in the Renewable Energy Directive that I’ve just mentioned, where this can secure the greatest benefit to the UK.

As part of this work, we are exploring the best way to increase investor confidence should it become clear that trading must be part of the UK’s path to meeting the 2020 target.
We are looking at how the UK’s existing and future support mechanisms could be used to support generation outside of the UK and the policy will need to consider and take account of the new mechanisms we are putting in place as part of Electricity Market Reform.

Charles Hendry speech to the National Offshore Wind Association of Ireland Annual Conference - Department of Energy and Climate Change

Join the dots.

[Freedom front]

A Joke , Exploiting Irish People !

[Pat Gill]

A Joke , Exploiting Irish People !

Who is being exploited ?

[CanRonPaulSavetheUS]

Surely to Jaysus, these loons have not been exposed yet. Who the hell does not know that wind energy is a complete scam and is both econonic insanity and technically idiotic.

These nutbags are going to waste 10 billion euro and the country facing starvation.

The country already has ample excess generation

[Pat Gill]

Surely to Jaysus, these loons have not been exposed yet. Who the hell does not know that wind energy is a complete scam and is both econonic insanity and technically idiotic.

These nutbags are going to waste 10 billion euro and the country facing starvation.

The country already has ample excess generation

AH Dan for an intelligent man you sure come out with lots of idealogical crap.

And in this case its grievously misinformed crap.

Read the thread.

[Toidissatafu]

A Joke , Exploiting Irish People !

All except the vested interests >> and their promoters.

Welcome to 2012 + version of the property boom >> financial opportunities for the rich from false prices.
This one is exclusively for a few land owners >> and those behind the PLC's making profits with zero risk from subsidies.

Ireland becoming a windmill plant for the UK >> sure.
Business interests both sides of the water up to another money making scam >> for themselves to make and run.

[Pat Gill]

All except the vested interests >> and their promoters.

Welcome to 2012 + version of the property boom >> financial opportunities for the rich from false prices.
This one is exclusively for a few land owners >> and those behind the PLC's making profits with zero risk from subsidies.

Ireland becoming a windmill plant for the UK >> sure.
Business interests both sides of the water up to another money making scam >> for themselves to make and run.

Landowners ????

We are talking about OFFSHORE windfarms.

And exporting electricity.

PLC's does that include semi states.

So your ideology is to refuse to create jobs.

Please enlighten me further.