Power lines and health

[SAT]

i take it you dislike farmers,
as for murdering eagles evidence please

I watched a documentary on this. Apparently livestock farmers aren't keen on the project to reintroduce Eagles to Ireland. Many of the breeding stock have been killed by poisoned meat bait. Whether the eagles are being targeted specifically or whether they are victims of a scatter gun approach against birds of prey generally is something only the farmers laying the poison bait can answer.

http://www.goldeneagle.ie/

Mystery of poisoned eagles - National News, Frontpage - Independent.ie

Poisoned bait suspected in death of sea eagle in Kerry - The Irish Times - Tue, Mar 17, 2009

Scots golden eagles 'put at risk of poisoning by move to Ireland' - The Scotsman | Encyclopedia.com

[fiannafailure]

Well, if of any assistance, I had a client once who wished to sue a certain telecoms provider and the ESB for the electomagnetic radiation she was suffering under. Apparently her mental illness was caused, in it's entirety, by such emanations.

She did, unfortunately, sport a tin foil hat, I kid you not. Another issue being that the WHO don't accept it as a medical issue.

corelli

Re the tin foil hat, this symbol surely proves your client's technical ignorance if not her mental illness, unless the hat was equipped with an excellent earthing mechanism, it would serve to attract, rather than dissipate such emanations. Perhaps you could pass on this advice to the next potential client of this type.

The WHO tend to expect evidence to support suspicion.

[Húrin]

I brought some visitors to Ireland on a trip around the Boyne valley recently, we visited the hill of Tara, Nowth, Dowth and Newgrange and as a bit of ancient Ireland anorak I thought that I had given my friends a good informative day out, however the journey home was taken up with a discussion on the very prominent home made signs littering the Boyne valley protesting about the new transmission lines that will form the southern arm of the North / South interconnector.

Dont give us Cancer, No pylons, Bury the Cables, No to Cancer. Painted onto everything from bales of silage to graffitti on walls.

What planet do these people live on and who is spreading such rubbish.

Over the past few decades over 25,000 studies have been done on the health effects of ELF fields and they have failed to find any evidence of a health risk from these fields.

What is happening here ?

AGW denial, sure What is happening here?

[realist]

What planet do these people live on and who is spreading such rubbish.

Over the past few decades over 25,000 studies have been done on the health effects of ELF fields and they have failed to find any evidence of a health risk from these fields.

What is happening here ?

A recent study in Switzerland showed a definite relationship between proximity to power lines and Alzheimers. In July 2009 the EU requested SCENIHR (EU committee who identify health risks) to do a high priority study on both Alzheimers and Leukemia and their relationship to power lines. They do not expect the final results for 2-3 years.

Residence near power lines and mortality from neur... [Am J Epidemiol. 2009] - PubMed result - (Alzheimers study)
Residential exposure to electric power transmissio... [Intern Med J. 2007] - PubMed result - (Leukemia)
http://ec.europa.eu/health/ph_risk/c...nihr_o_024.pdf

[fiannafailure]

A recent study in Switzerland showed a definite relationship between proximity to power lines and Alzheimers. In July 2009 the EU requested SCENIHR (EU committee who identify health risks) to do a high priority study on both Alzheimers and Leukemia and their relationship to power lines. They do not expect the final results for 2-3 years.

Residence near power lines and mortality from neur... [Am J Epidemiol. 2009] - PubMed result - (Alzheimers study)
Residential exposure to electric power transmissio... [Intern Med J. 2007] - PubMed result - (Leukemia)
http://ec.europa.eu/health/ph_risk/c...nihr_o_024.pdf

Realist

Again you will find that any effect will be limited to people who actually live within a few metres of a power line, the electrical or magnetic field effects diminish very rapidly with distance. At 50m distance you are at background levels.

[charley]

the poison was not purposely laid to kill eagles, foxes and grey crows would be the vermin that they were trying to get rid of.the eagles were just colateral damage
Murder, as defined in common law countries, is the unlawful killing of another human being with intent. the killing of an eagle is just a killing of an animal

[sparkey321]

- hay bails wrapped in giant black plastic bags - scenic

Not to discuss with the rest of your post but.

Number one its bale not bail.

Number 2 hay is not wrapped in plastic. If you did it would rot. Silage is wrapped in plastic, if you didn't it would rot.


As for the rest of your post. Generalities are easy.

I could how you any farms that re pristine with no falling down hay sheds, correct gates, well maintained hedgerows, wouldn't dream of harming eagles, and take excellent care of their land and its water sources (its in their interest to take care of it asthey use it to water their animals and to supply their own drinking water. (no mains water for farmers).

If generalities are what you want then I can provide many about urban areas, pouring untreated sewage in rivers and sea, asbestos ridden abandoned, falling appart industrial parks, graffiti etc etc etc.

And for the record I am not a farmer nor have I ever been one.

[realist]

Realist

Again you will find that any effect will be limited to people who actually live within a few metres of a power line, the electrical or magnetic field effects diminish very rapidly with distance. At 50m distance you are at background levels.

Not according to the link for Leukemia:

"Adults who had lived within 300 m of a power line during the first 15 years of life had a threefold increase in risk (OR 3.23; 1.26-8.29); those who had lived within the same distance aged 0-5 years had a fivefold increase in risk."

Residential exposure to electric power transmissio... [Intern Med J. 2007] - PubMed result

[willoughby]

The fact is these people live in the area and have the right to protest at something that is going to change their area. If yo someday are travelling through Meath with say American friends and they were to remark on how ugly the power lines are and that they would not endear them to return to this particular area what would you say then, the fact of the matter is that the lines could be put underground and although I am aware this would be vastly more expensive it still means that the lines would be performing the same job only underground. People have every right to have concerns about changes made to their living space.

[fiannafailure]

Realist,

I will confine my references to the website you linked to,

Childhood cancer in relation to distance from high voltage power lines in England and Wales: a case-control study

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15933351?ordinalpos=1&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez. Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsPanel.Pubmed_SingleItemSupl.P ubmed_Discovery_RA&linkpos=1&log$=relatedarticles& logdbfrom=pubmed

About 4% of children in England and Wales live within 600 m of high voltage lines at birth. If the association is causal, about 1% of childhood leukaemia in England and Wales would be attributable to these lines, though this estimate has considerable statistical uncertainty. There is no accepted biological mechanism to explain the epidemiological results; indeed, the relation may be due to chance or confounding.

From the link you supplied I qoute the following

CONCLUSION: Although recognizing that this study has limitations, the results raise the possibility that prolonged residence close to high-voltage power lines, especially early in life, may increase the risk of the development of MPD and LPD later.

So lets have a look at the physics

Firstly, it is recognised that magnetic fields above 12 microtesla 12 µT will have health effects after prolonged exposure, If you stand directly beneath a 220KVA transmission line you will experience a field strength of up to 6 µT, at 50m distance that field strength will be below 1 µT, the field strenght in the average home varies between .2 and .5µT, the high figure will be felt within 1 or 2 feet of the fuseboard or electric shower and if single core cable has been used to power your shower as opposed to twin and earth, that high figure will be experienced along the lenght of the cable run.

The limitations of the studies quoted above must include the lack of investigation of other sources of magnetic fields experienced by these patients.

If there is a genuine fear of exposure to ELF magnetic fields, I would suggest in the first instance an investigation of the wiring in your home and your appliances.

I wonder how many homes in the Boyne valley have been tested for a proven carcinogen, radon gas.

I have lived almost my entire life within 100m of a power line.

But there is another aspect of this subject which seems to ignored, a transmission line running through farmland has an extremely low impact on the on the agricultural use of that land, an underground ac line will have a larger impact on the types of agriculture carried on and will still have associated magnetic fields, an underground line will also have larger electrical losses and in general is not as reliable.

HVDC may be what these people are asking for, if so get ready for much higher electricity prices to pay for it.