'Reform' list to fill political vacuum for economic crisis and Lisbon No

[west'sawake]

The Anti Lisbon voters fell into four Categories. Some of the terms used are pejorative, (for example many on the Christian/Catholic Right tend to be to the centre or centre left on economics and often are involved in social justice), but I'll stick with these terms for convenience.

1) The Christian Right.

2) The 'authentic' left alliance (Anti War, Socialist workers, Dissenting Greens, as in Boyd Barratt, Joe Higgins, Patricia McKenna)

3) Sinn Fein

4) Independent Councillors and even some councillors from Pro Lisbon Political Parties who publically declared they were voting against Lisbon. Some of whom canvassed and some of whom didn't, but at least those who declared themselves 'No', aided the No cause.

5) Others. ( Inc. Hard Euro sceptics)

I need help in compiling a list of local candidates in your respective local authorities, so that this list can be put together and distributed to all the voters. Could you also assign each councillor/candidate you metnion to one of the above categories,

For example in Donegal, S.F candidates/Councillors and the FF councillor Joe Kelly are all publically on the record as No to Lisbon, as well as Inde Town Councillor Jim Lynch in Letterkenny. In Co Galway a FG councillor campaigned against Lsibon, with the surname Burke I think.

Libertas is only running at European Level, so it is vital that the political vacuum of 'Reform' of all our institutions, among othere things, since their is public waste and corruption allover the place, be addressed for the times we live in.

For example, here's an interesting Fact, in Mayo the cost of all the local councillors, urban and county is in excess of 9 million euro, average earnings inc salary and expenses are 41,000 euro. If there are about 40 local authorites, and Mayo I believe is not one of the most profligate, we may be looking at 500 million at least in costs to the tax payer, for local politicians who don't really have all that much power. Surely this cut be cut to 150 million easily.

Today: Connacht Ulster and Leinster,

Could someone else oblige with Leinster and Dublin.

Please Fill in below: and specify UDC/Borough or Co Co.

Connacht Ulster:

Cavan

Donegal

Monaghan

Galway

Leitrim

Mayo

Roscommon

Sligo

Munster:

Clare

Cork

Kerry

Limerick

Tipperary

Waterford

[FutureTaoiseach]

I would add another category: Pro status-quo voters who oppose Lisbon but are pro-EU, and pro-EU voters who support reforms of the EU institutions but not along Lisbon lines.

[mccafferty cat]

I would add another category: Pro status-quo voters who oppose Lisbon but are pro-EU, and pro-EU voters who support reforms of the EU institutions but not along Lisbon lines.

You obviously think that yourself and your Libertas chums fit into one of these categories.

The fact is that Mr. Ganley falls into neither - he is a self-proclaimed Eurofederalist.

[QuizMaster]

What has Lisbon got to do with local elections??
You elect councillors to deal with local issues. The local elections are not some sort of mock elections where we check the boxes of our favourite parties. They are real elections. The people you elect will have a profound effect on your life. They alone vote through the development plan. They alone can decide to be crooked or straight when it comes to planning permission, public contracts, etc.

Stop using local elections as some sort of referendum.

[Seos]

As Libertas is only running at European Level, it is vital that the political vacuum of 'Reform'
of all our institutions since their is public waste in all, be addressed for the times we live in.

Hang so you're saying that just because they voted no in Lisbon people should assume that they want reform at all levels and also the inverse that the ones who voted yes don't want reform?

That's ridiculous! Why don't you instead get a list of politicians who say they want reform?

[PhoenixIreland]

I have trouble voting for local elections as it is...why would Lisbon candidates stand for local councils????? They don't even have the power over the local primary school much less Europe!

[Evestown2]

What are you on about West'sawake? Local elections have precious little to do with Lisbon and will be fought on issues that are much closer to home. Even then half of the relevant issues will be outside of the scope of a councillor.

But your analysis of the anti-Lisbon categories shows how little attention you paid to the last campaign.

Come back with a sensible list of categories and, perhaps, people will help you.

[west'sawake]

Hang so you're saying that just because they voted no in Lisbon people should assume that they want reform at all levels and also the inverse that the ones who voted yes don't want reform?

That's ridiculous! Why don't you instead get a list of politicians who say they want reform?

Seos

No I am not saying that, but at the moment it is even more ridiculous that 85% of the political Establishment have turned their backs on the will of the people. I am probably going to vote F.G. or Ind at local level, and for Ganley if he runs for Europe in Connacht Ulster and give my second preference to the next anti Lisbon Candidate, be it of the left, republican, or whatever hue. But I will not vote for any FG or Ind who has not publically declared against Lisbon. I believe this can be made an issue, among other things.

There is a serious political vacuum that is not being filled. We should be able to 'acclaim' and support those who were on the No side, be they left or right. What we are talking about is the politics of an Alliance so No voters can ensure they are not indirectly affirming political parties who have rejected the will of the people. At least for example in Donegal FF voters in one area who voted No to Lisbon can vote for Councillor Kelly. Ditto Burke in Galway for F.G. It would give FF, FG and Labour food for thought if they see some of their own returned because of where they stand on Lisbon.

On the reform issue, that is secondary, but in way very relevant, as there really is too much public waste. Getting people elected on a common platform of unity against Lisbon, and less public waste, is surely a good exercise in democracy, is it not?

Actually I think FG, FF and Labour would really hate this. It means they will have to face the contradictions of having supporters who said No, no longer being disenfranchised. In the case of FG and Labour polls show a majority of their supporters, voted no.

[west'sawake]

What are you on about West'sawake? Local elections have precious little to do with Lisbon and will be fought on issues that are much closer to home. Even then half of the relevant issues will be outside of the scope of a councillor.

But your analysis of the anti-Lisbon categories shows how little attention you paid to the last campaign.

Come back with a sensible list of categories and, perhaps, people will help you.

Sorry, I might not be clear here. Of course you are right, local elections will and should be fought on local issues, and that can be done. It's just that the Councillor/candidate could be identifed as pro or anti lisbon, as pro or anti democratic, a someone who supports the will of the people.

[west'sawake]

I would add another category: Pro status-quo voters who oppose Lisbon but are pro-EU, and pro-EU voters who support reforms of the EU institutions but not along Lisbon lines.

FT

I see where you are coming from with this, but I and believe me many many others, just want to be able to help the voters in each local authority to affrim those candidates/councillors who support the will of the people. Actually your idea of ' supporting the status quo' is all embracing, and a good one. Now have you any names anywhere?