Teachers Pay

[Proposition Joe]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]It's a bull$hit graph. Wages are relative to what it cost to live in each of those countries. If those PD and FF f*ckers hadn't inflated the cost of living here so much Irish teachers wouldn’t be on that point on that graph.[/FONT][/COLOR]

Do you know what PPP stands for in this context?

I'll give you a clue. Its not public-private partnership. Nor is it point-to-point protocol.

[Middleaged]

[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]It's a bull$hit graph. Wages are relative to what it cost to live in each of those countries.[/FONT][/COLOR]

Christ, and there's me going through life thinking that wages were the reward/payment for one's labour.

But no,now its relative to the cost of living.

I must remember that next time I'm negotiating a contract.

[slumdog1971]

And of course the only people responsible for inflation were politicians and developrs. Nothing to do with wage demands, nothing at all to do with partnershhip etc . NOthing to do with joe public paying over the odds for property prices, or second homes, rental property etc. Que the chicken and egg argument

Nothing at all do with the Chicken and Egg.

If wage costs had stayed low in Ireland, do you honestly think that the Shopkeepers wouldn't have started profiteering ? or the developers, or the builders and plumbers or the dentists and doctors or the solicitors and barristers. ? That would be very naive of you.

Wages do not set the cost of goods and services in this Country. We are not a nation of high moral standing. We are a nation of grubby little shopkeepers who will take all we can get at every opportunity we can get.

Don't blame the worker or the unions for the high cost of Living in this country.

[wexfordman]

Nothing at all do with the Chicken and Egg.

If wage costs had stayed low in Ireland, do you honestly think that the Shopkeepers wouldn't have started profiteering ? or the developers, or the builders and plumbers or the dentists and doctors or the solicitors and barristers. ? That would be very naive of you.

Wages do not set the cost of goods and services in this Country. We are not a nation of high moral standing. We are a nation of grubby little shopkeepers who will take all we can get at every opportunity we can get.

Don't blame the worker or the unions for the high cost of Living in this country.

Dont be an idiot, the workers, private sector and public secotr were as guilty of profiteering as anyone, perhaps on a different scale, but guilty nonetheless. I

[DeathKnell]

Don't blame the worker or the unions for the high cost of Living in this country.

Equally, do not absolve them of all blame.

Fact is - they were part of the vested interests and Unions stuck their noses in the trough of the property led tax boon as much if not more so than everyone else.

[Ernie Ball]

Oh wait, hang on, they have another trick:
Call overwhelming evidence AGAINST their argument overwhelming evidence IN FAVOUR of their argument. Really must remember that trick - I think I'll call it "The Ostrich".

You haven't a clue what you're talking about. I suggest you look at the OECD report entitled Education at a Glance 2008, p. 453. There you'll find Irish teachers comfortably in the middle of the pack on the metric of pay in US$ per contact hour (adjusted using PPPs).

The per diem statistic Ronan Lyons is citing is worse than meaningless for a job like teaching. Indeed, it's highly misleading. If you think it's not, I assume you'd have no objection to reducing the daily contact hours of teachers for the same salary.

And none of this takes into account class sizes. But only an ideologue would insist that all that matters is the final salary and the days worked, not the hours worked or the numbers of students.

[Proposition Joe]

You haven't a clue what you're talking about. I suggest you look at the OECD report entitled Education at a Glance 2008, p. 453. There you'll find Irish teachers comfortably in the middle of the pack on the metric of pay in US$ per contact hour (adjusted using PPPs).

Interestingly on that same page of the report we see that the length of the Irish teaching salary scale is also comfortably in the middle of the pack.

In fact, the Irish scale is shorter than both the OECD and EU19 averages.

This despite it being oft-claimed on this site and elsewhere as one of the longest scales in the world.

Well, I guess anything longer than the shortest is "one of the longest"

[wexfordman]

Well they could always propose getting rid of the dastardly salary scale and go for performance related pay instead !!

[Bonzo1970]

The origin of Career breaks is obvious-encourages people to try other careers and thus if they dont come back it creates movements. career breaks are not unknown in Private sector but the Anti-teacher brigade dont acknowledge that. I could cite cases but there is some soft porn coming up on the Tudors at ten.

Very few teachers fill in for 5 yrs of a career break-it got me in the door and eventually got a permanent job. Look why dont you just give me a bowl of porridge a day,some raw meat and we can call it a deal for my salary. You really wont please some people-be a man (are there some real men out there or do your wives/partners have your balls?)admit that even if you had us working 48 weeks of the year and cut salaries by30 % you would still hate teachers-go on be a man or feel like a real woman:admit It!

[punchdrunk]

Well they could always propose getting rid of the dastardly salary scale and go for performance related pay instead !!

What nonsense. Populist poppycock.