Originally Posted by Eire1976

Are you native Irish?

If so, what is the probklem with you learning your own language?

Why aren't you happy to learn it?

English is the native and national language of Ireland, has been for many generations.

If you need an simple analogy to make it easier for you to understand this, thatching was once the roofing method used in Ireland but as we developed new tooling and craft, this ceased to be the case. Thatching is still available to those who WANT it, it has not died out.

The Irish language lobby, just like the gun lobby in the US, cower behind the constitution while we spend €1 BILLION per annum on teaching and promoting Irish with negligible results. A real measure of this was Brod Club which achieved an embarrassing 24,000 followers, about 0.5% of our population. As a resident of Spiddal, I can confirm that the vast majority of kids here just have no interest in speaking Irish.

Originally Posted by EndDiddlyaism

English is the native and national language of Ireland, has been for many generations.

If you need an simple analogy to make it easier for you to understand this, thatching was once the roofing method used in Ireland but as we developed new tooling and craft, this ceased to be the case. Thatching is still available to those who WANT it, it has not died out.

The Irish language lobby, just like the gun lobby in the US, cower behind the constitution while we spend €1 BILLION per annum on teaching and promoting Irish with negligible results. A real measure of this was Brod Club which achieved an embarrassing 24,000 followers, about 0.5% of our population. As a resident of Spiddal, I can confirm that the vast majority of kids here just have no interest in speaking Irish.

English isn't the native languege, it's the adopted language that has become prominent.

What's wrong with reviving the native language of Ireland?

Language doesn't let people down, it's weak people who are letting the language down.

Originally Posted by Fun with Irish

To make Irish a subject of choice in the Leaving Certificate would make sense if compulsory Irish were an educational or cultural matter. But it's not. It's a political matter.

I disagree. Having it as a compulsory subject is an educational/cultural matter. The hijacking of Irish by politicians and causes is wrong and damaging. It belongs to all those who consider themselves Irish (regardless of religious background, colour of skin, political beliefs).

Originally Posted by Red_93

Having set up this thread in the gaeilge forum, I decided to set up a similar a discussion as Béarla so that everyone could have their say!

This year (2012) was the first year of the new leaving cert Irish syllabus, which saw a number of major changes and aimed primarily to improve oral linguistic ability and increase uptake at higher level. Now before I start I'd like to warn that I am IN FAVOUR of the new syllabus so I am (probably) biased.
The most notable changes were:

1)The awarding of 40% of the overall mark to the oral exam. This aimed to increase focus on the spoken aspect of the language. Topics dealt with in the cómhrá section of the oral exam are generally far more practical and relevant to a student's life than any other section of the test ie, one is asked about one's life, interests, family, future plans, education etc etc. One major criticism is that an entire 40% of the candidate's grade is now dependent on a mere 15 minutes, which is clearly a major flaw...

2)A new format to the oral exam. Candidates are now asked to narrate one of 20 picture stories, chosen at random (as in German). A major criticism of this of course is the potential for rote learning but I personally found that 20 pic stories were too much to rote learn so I simply learned nice phrases for describing various emotions plus any peculiar vocab specific to each one and found that that worked particularly well. In addition, candidates asked the oral examiner 3 questions on their picture story. IMO this is a welcome step as nowhere in any of the language syllabi is there any scope for testing a candidate's ability to pose questions, which is odd considering it is a key facet of any language. In addition candidates are asked three short questions about the picture stories. There are also 5 marks going for being able to hello, say how one is when asked, say one's address, date of birth and exam number (a mark each). That might sound easy but it's 5 out of 600 so nothing really, plus ensures knowledge of the basics.

It sounds fair enough, even though I hated Irish. I remember I was nervous at the start of my mock oral and the first question was about my family and I got the words drahaar and drehoor (brother and sister) mixed up. Then I had to make up answers to questions about brothers of mine who didn't exist. It was hell.

Originally Posted by ger12

I disagree. Having it as a compulsory subject is an educational/cultural matter. The hijacking of Irish by politicians and causes is wrong and damaging. It belongs to all those who consider themselves Irish (regardless of religious background, colour of skin, political beliefs).

it's also political. Knowledge is power and power is political.

Irish doesn't really belong to all those who consider themselves Irish - probably to just some of them.

Originally Posted by bob3367

Have a look at modern English, its peppered with words that frankly need expulsion.
.

Thank you so much for not stating "need expelling"

Originally Posted by Eire1976

English isn't the native languege, it's the adopted language that has become prominent.

What's wrong with reviving the native language of Ireland?

Language doesn't let people down, it's weak people who are letting the language down.

If people want it, it is there for them, if they don't, why should they be forced to learn it?

Compulsion has not worked, it will never work and meanwhle, it is costing us €1 BILLION per annum to teach and promote Irish,

Is this the best use of teaching and GDLA resources, especially when only a tiny minority have any interest in actually learning to speak Irish properly?

Why would you describe someone that embraces English as their national & native language (i.e. the 97% of our citizens that CHOOSE it) as weak? Perhaps they wish to pursue other interests other than language, Irish or otherwise?

Originally Posted by Eire1976

English isn't the native languege, it's the adopted language that has become prominent.

What's wrong with reviving the native language of Ireland?

Language doesn't let people down, it's weak people who are letting the language down.

And what did the ''Irish'' speak before Irish? Is modern Irish the real native language? What did Clonycavan Man speak? Perhaps, given that whatever he did was more native than what we are doing now, we should re-construct his culture and force his long-dead language down the throats of school children?

Crazy you say? Well, what's wrong with reviving the native language of Ireland?

EndDiddlyaism has stated the problem and the solution accurately and concisely. Far too much time and money has been squandered on a language that few people wish to speak.

I think we need to start teaching it properly, why have we failed in this regard? It must be an extremely difficult language to learn.

Personally, I absolutely love the language and I hope to learn it properly in the future when I get the time.

For beginners.

BBC - Irish - Giota Beag: Irish Level 1