teacher allowances

[birthday]

The Irish Times - Latest News from Ireland

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...pO4APY59nxpLRg

Irish times reports that a teacher (2ndary,new entrant Jan 2012) will have total salary of €32240 (€27814 plus €4426 degree allowance)
In Sep 2010 the total was €39195.

Two points given that most graduates start on €24k (median) and house prices are down 50% plus from peak
Is €32240 really that bad to start on?
Were we really paying €39195 just before IMF arrived?

[harshreality]

A dangerous topic Birthday.
You dont wanna incur the wrath of the teachers!

[making waves]

The Irish Times - Latest News from Ireland

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...pO4APY59nxpLRg

It might help if your links actually made some sense

I take it this was the link you are after -

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/...311112843.html

Now specifically to the points you are making

Irish times reports that a teacher (2ndary,new entrant Jan 2012) will have total salary of €32240 (€27814 plus €4426 degree allowance)

The article does not give this figure - and the figure is wrong

In Sep 2010 the total was €39195.

No it wasn't

Two points given that most graduates start on €24k (median) and house prices are down 50% plus from peak

To start with - second-level teachers have a postgraduate qualification - not a graduate one.

Were we really paying €39195 just before IMF arrived?

No

On a broader point - do you want children to be taught by highly motivated well-paid educators or do you want them to simply engage in crowd control (which is what they do in the UK with their poor salary). The government are butchering the education system - so much for a knowledge economy.

[RobertW]

The opening poster obviously is not aware that allowances for new teachers were scrapped on 01 Feb leaving a new teacher on an annual wage of €27814 assuming their post is a full time post.

Most starting teachers do not receive full time posts but pro-rata posts on less time and hence less money.

Two teachers I'm aware of started their careers in September on 11 hours meaning they would receive an annual gross wage of €13907 on these cuts for the responsibility of teaching 4 classes or around 100 students each for 3 hours per week.

Add in no chance of permanency (i.e. Applying every few months for jobs), or promotion and yet expected to do hours of further work for free by Principals and it's pretty clear that this is becoming a job which has no future in Ireland for new teachers.

[Harmonica]

While its very clear that new teachers are taking a large cut (is it a cut if you never had the money?) but 39K seems a crazy starting salary for teacher. I don't think 39K is mentioned on the link but I did read this article in the IT. Surely a H. Dip is the basic requirement for teaching? Why did they get paid extra for this? When the unions signed up to the CPA they knew this was the consequence of protecting their base pay - allowances will be slashed everywhere in desperate effort to save any money.

I am not surprised to see graduate salaries taking a huge hit in recent years - I think Accenture announced a batch of those recently at 30K & they would be picking some of the better grads.

[making waves]

Most starting teachers do not receive full time posts but pro-rata posts on less time and hence less money.

Nearly half the teachers in my school are on part-time contracts.

[birthday]

It might help if your links actually made some sense

I take it this was the link you are after -

New teaching entrants to earn 30% less than their colleagues - The Irish Times - Thu, Feb 02, 2012

Now specifically to the points you are making


The article does not give this figure - and the figure is wrong


No it wasn't


To start with - second-level teachers have a postgraduate qualification - not a graduate one.


No

On a broader point - do you want children to be taught by highly motivated well-paid educators or do you want them to simply engage in crowd control (which is what they do in the UK with their poor salary). The government are butchering the education system - so much for a knowledge economy.

The figures are given in the table which accompanies the article.
If they are wrong can you provide proof.
The median for other graduates is €24k. Even with HDip, is €32240 not an attractive salary?

[patslatt]

It might help if your links actually made some sense

I take it this was the link you are after -

New teaching entrants to earn 30% less than their colleagues - The Irish Times - Thu, Feb 02, 2012

Now specifically to the points you are making


The article does not give this figure - and the figure is wrong


No it wasn't


To start with - second-level teachers have a postgraduate qualification - not a graduate one.


No

On a broader point - do you want children to be taught by highly motivated well-paid educators or do you want them to simply engage in crowd control (which is what they do in the UK with their poor salary). The government are butchering the education system - so much for a knowledge economy.

Teachers on contract hung around in the past for years in hard times in the hope of becoming permanent on a high salary. So why didn't that experience "butcher" the education system in the past?

[RobertW]

The figures are given in the table which accompanies the article.
If they are wrong can you provide proof.
The median for other graduates is €24k. Even with HDip, is €32240 not an attractive salary?

Did I not just point out to you in post 4 that there are no longer allowances for new teachers?

[Mushroom]

ASTI scales and allowances - although, as RobW has stated, allowances aren't being paid to newbie teachers.