Will guidance counsellor cuts increase the suicide rates among our youth?

[theloner]

Recently, there has been widespread debate in our schools and classrooms in regards to the usefulness and necessity of guidance counsellors, so do you think was it a good thing the FF motion calling for a reversal of Budget decisions affecting guidance counsellor posts was defeated?

Obviously FG's Lawlor blamed it on FF, claiming all the aces had been removed from the playing deck by the previous government, another FGer, Mary Mitchell O'Connor equally washed her hands of it claiming the government was only in 20 percent control of the education budget, stating the other four fifths went on salaries and costs. (Which incidentally made my stomach jump).

Those on the left are crying foul and believe those from the weaker sections of society will suffer most with the FG/Lab cuts to education. Our very own Ming Flanagan even claimed suicides will increase due to these decisions, warning TDs not to cry crocodile tears when our young are throwing up the rope due to their inability to connect with the only solace many of our children from broken homes can face - a guidance counsellor.

FF's Timmy Dooley was even afforded applause and praise from current guidance counsellors from the gallery for his supportive words before being silenced by Enda Ken...*cough*..sorry, Cathaoirleach. SF's Sean Crowe, along with the Socialists have lambasted the decisions claiming the disappearance of guidance counsellors coincides with the alarming rise in the rate of suicides, self-harm and depression among the Irish youth. Crowe went even further saying such cuts may even breach Section 9c of the 1998 Education Act, that states 'students have access to appropriate guidance to assist them in their educational and career choices'.

So what ye think?

[TheYouthVote]

My answer? No.
My guidance councillor when I went to school showed up for 3 hours in the morning, two days a week. She made dozens of appointments everyday and only fulfilled 3 or 4. Worse than useless.
Maybe some schools have decent guidance councillors but I've yet to meet any. Instilling confidence in the young people that they may one day actually be able to get a job in this country and getting rid of the mindset where we judge people on who their parents are, how big their house is and on how they look and dress and who they fall in love with etc etc. would do a lot more to lessen suicide rates in young people in Ireland.
I'm all in favour of calling the government to task on things but sometimes it's a societal issue and the buck cannot be passed.

[theloner]

My answer? No.
My guidance councillor when I went to school showed up for 3 hours in the morning, two days a week. She made dozens of appointments everyday and only fulfilled 3 or 4. Worse than useless.
Maybe some schools have decent guidance councillors but I've yet to meet any. Instilling confidence in the young people that they may one day actually be able to get a job in this country and getting rid of the mindset where we judge people on who their parents are, how big their house is and on how they look and dress and who they fall in love with etc etc. would do a lot more to lessen suicide rates in young people in Ireland.
I'm all in favour of calling the government to task on things but sometimes it's a societal issue and the buck cannot be passed.

I was hoping someone of the 'less old generation' would reply first, giving their own personal account as, I, like you, had the same experience of guidance counsellors. I ain't saying they are useless but they never really changed my life or set the wheels in motion to the direction in which I am now running. Others however, may have gotten more out of it than you or I. Cheers TYV.

[Mr. Bumble]

Recently, there has been widespread debate in our schools and classrooms in regards to the usefulness and necessity of guidance counsellors, so do you think was it a good thing the FF motion calling for a reversal of Budget decisions affecting guidance counsellor posts was defeated?

Obviously FG's Lawlor blamed it on FF, claiming all the aces had been removed from the playing deck by the previous government, another FGer, Mary Mitchell O'Connor equally washed her hands of it claiming the government was only in 20 percent control of the education budget, stating the other four fifths went on salaries and costs. (Which incidentally made my stomach jump).

Those on the left are crying foul and believe those from the weaker sections of society will suffer most with the FG/Lab cuts to education. Our very own Ming Flanagan even claimed suicides will increase due to these decisions, warning TDs not to cry crocodile tears when our young are throwing up the rope due to their inability to connect with the only solace many of our children from broken homes can face - a guidance counsellor.

FF's Timmy Dooley was even afforded applause and praise from current guidance counsellors from the gallery for his supportive words before being silenced by Enda Ken...*cough*..sorry, Cathaoirleach. SF's Sean Crowe, along with the Socialists have lambasted the decisions claiming the disappearance of guidance counsellors coincides with the alarming rise in the rate of suicides, self-harm and depression among the Irish youth. Crowe went even further saying such cuts may even breach Section 9c of the 1998 Education Act, that states 'students have access to appropriate guidance to assist them in their educational and career choices'.

So what ye think?

Though guidance counsellors are primarily trained to provide guidance on careers, subject choices etc. and have limited training in psychological therapy, they also provide a relatively neutral and objective person that a troubled student can engage with in a reasonably confidential setting. A suicidal teenager may well believe, rightly or wrongly, that their parents/friends won't understand. Indeed parents and/or friends may well be the cause of the suicidal ideation.

So yes, cuts in guidance counsellor numbers will lead to an increase in suicide among secondary school students.

[hurling_lad]

I have never heard of the idea that guidance counsellors in Ireland somehow double as psychotherapists.

Does anyone have any experience of a Guidance Counsellor acting in such a role?

[spooneycooney]

Though guidance counsellors are primarily trained to provide guidance on careers, subject choices etc. and have limited training in psychological therapy, they also provide a relatively neutral and objective person that a troubled student can engage with in a reasonably confidential setting. A suicidal teenager may well believe, rightly or wrongly, that their parents/friends won't understand. Indeed parents and/or friends may well be the cause of the suicidal ideation.

So yes, cuts in guidance counsellor numbers will lead to an increase in suicide among secondary school students.

Well in order to prove this we'd have to look at all suicides of young people and see if their school had a guidance counsellor before they took their own life. How many of those young people that killed themselves in the last 2 years went to schools with guidance counsellors?

[CookieMonster]

I know of nobody who has had a good experience with a "Guidance" counsellor. Certainly in my school their advice consisted of several levels:

1. Apply to Trinity
2. Apply to UCD
3. Apply to nearest NUI
4. Apply to DIT
5. Apply to country IT
6. Apply for PLC course
7. Get trade apprenticeship
6. Apply to Tesco.

Didn't really matter what subject one wished to study.

[Mr. Bumble]

Well in order to prove this we'd have to look at all suicides of young people and see if their school had a guidance counsellor before they took their own life. How many of those young people that killed themselves in the last 2 years went to schools with guidance counsellors?

I doubt if my thesis is provable with statistics.

[Radix]

Recently, there has been widespread debate in our schools and classrooms in regards to the usefulness and necessity of guidance counsellors, so do you think was it a good thing the FF motion calling for a reversal of Budget decisions affecting guidance counsellor posts was defeated?

Obviously FG's Lawlor blamed it on FF, claiming all the aces had been removed from the playing deck by the previous government, another FGer, Mary Mitchell O'Connor equally washed her hands of it claiming the government was only in 20 percent control of the education budget, stating the other four fifths went on salaries and costs. (Which incidentally made my stomach jump).

Those on the left are crying foul and believe those from the weaker sections of society will suffer most with the FG/Lab cuts to education. Our very own Ming Flanagan even claimed suicides will increase due to these decisions, warning TDs not to cry crocodile tears when our young are throwing up the rope due to their inability to connect with the only solace many of our children from broken homes can face - a guidance counsellor.

FF's Timmy Dooley was even afforded applause and praise from current guidance counsellors from the gallery for his supportive words before being silenced by Enda Ken...*cough*..sorry, Cathaoirleach. SF's Sean Crowe, along with the Socialists have lambasted the decisions claiming the disappearance of guidance counsellors coincides with the alarming rise in the rate of suicides, self-harm and depression among the Irish youth. Crowe went even further saying such cuts may even breach Section 9c of the 1998 Education Act, that states 'students have access to appropriate guidance to assist them in their educational and career choices'.

So what ye think?

Well at least this Government doesn't lack consistency, even if it does lack creativity.

With a bit of thought and effort the HSL scheme, the career guidance scheme and the chaplaincy scheme could have been rejigged.

And Mary Miss Piggy O' Connor, pleaaseee!

If every anyone needed a guidance counsellor (sponsored by Garmin ©), it has to be her.

[Radix]

I know of nobody who has had a good experience with a "Guidance" counsellor. Certainly in my school their advice consisted of several levels:

1. Apply to Trinity
2. Apply to UCD
3. Apply to nearest NUI
4. Apply to DIT
5. Apply to country IT
6. Apply for PLC course
7. Get trade apprenticeship
6. Apply to Tesco.

Didn't really matter what subject one wished to study.

And you ended up with 35,000 posts on an internet board...