Minute silence in schools at noon to remember the famine. Why can't we move on?

[ellie08]

Famous Irish Scientists

This is what we should be 'celebrating' instead of going on about rotten potatoes.

[The Underdog]

Sir Charles Edward Trevelyan, 1st Baronet, KCB (1807–1886)

As Assistant Secretary to the Treasury he was placed in charge of the administration of Government relief to the victims of the Irish Famine in the 1840s. In the middle of that crisis Trevelyan published his views on the matter. He saw the Famine as a "mechanism for reducing surplus population". He described the famine as "The judgement of God sent the calamity to teach the Irish a lesson, that calamity must not be too much mitigated."

"The greatest evil we have to face is not the physical evil of the famine," Trevelyan wrote, "but the moral evil of the selfish, perverse and turbulent character of the Irish people."

In an 1848 article in the Edinburgh Review - at the height of the famine - he applauded the fact that starvation encouraged migration and supported the view that God was punishing the Irish Catholics for their superstitious ways and adherence to 'popery'. He was knighted by Queen Victoria that same year for his "work" on the famine.

Sources
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/an...ory-80792.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sir_Cha...n,_1st_Baronet

[Scipio]

Perhaps they should have planted more than potatoes or gone fishing, or did the British ban these things? ffs. This is the auld sh$te that was taught in schools, poor Irish, downtrodden and good old Catholic Church saved us. The last time I was at mass was Christmas two years ago, where the priest delighted in telling us that the good people of the city paid and built the beautiful cathedral we were sitting during the famine times - I nearly got sick.

The Catholic Church most certainly did not save us and I would never claim that they did. In fact, they did absolutely nothing. They sat at home while their people starved to death. Their role was reprehensible and they should apologize for it forthwith.

The only religious group which truly did anything for the starving, was the Quakers.

That said, the reasons why the famine happened are clear. An overdependence on the potato crop, and inaction by an uncaring British government to stop it.

There had been famines in Ireland before, some causing many deaths. However, in all cases it had been tackled adequately by shutting off exports and feeding the hungry. Why? Because even under the Protestant Ascendancy, Ireland controlled her own affairs. After the Act of Union, that valve was shut off.

The famine was a defining event in our history and in how our country was shaped afterwards. It should be remembered, that's the least we owe to the one million plus men, women and children who starved to death, needlessly.

[Sailor]

Perhaps they should have planted more than potatoes or gone fishing, or did the British ban these things? ffs. This is the auld sh$te that was taught in schools, poor Irish, downtrodden and good old Catholic Church saved us. The last time I was at mass was Christmas two years ago, where the priest delighted in telling us that the good people of the city paid and built the beautiful cathedral we were sitting during the famine times - I nearly got sick.

The land had been divided up into smaller and smaller plots to the extent that no other crop would have sustained the population of 9 million. As for fishing, shortly after the early crop failures the people sold their fishing gear to buy food - not very wise in hindsight but you're talking about desperate circumstances. There was also an issue that many of the peasant population did not know how to cook anything but the spud. You also remarked earlier that the death toll was due more to disease than famine - it actually was famine related disease.

[Fir Bolg]

Perhaps they should have planted more than potatoes or gone fishing, or did the British ban these things? ffs. This is the auld sh$te that was taught in schools, poor Irish, downtrodden and good old Catholic Church saved us. The last time I was at mass was Christmas two years ago, where the priest delighted in telling us that the good people of the city paid and built the beautiful cathedral we were sitting during the famine times - I nearly got sick.

The planting of more potatoes would have resulted in more arable land being used to cultivate a crop that would be wiped out by blight. The Irish fishing/trading fleet had been wiped out centuries before under draconian English laws governing the ownership and operation of sailing vessels from Ireland. It didn't stop many local people resorting to the sea for sustenance. However there was never enough to go around. Even today people from Castlebar are referred to as Fishheads by people from Westport. This is an insult thrown at them as a result of famine victims eating the discarded heads of fish.

The Catholic church were every bit as complicit in their contempt for the Irish poor as were the government in Britain and middle class and aristocracy in Ireland

[Interista]

There was plenty of food in Ireland at the time,

Isn't that the case with many famines though?

IE in absolute terms there is enough food to keep almost everyone alive, but due to problems with infrastructure or gross inequality, the food does not get distributed to the bulk of the population, who die needlessly. Hence Amartya Sen's line about there never having been a famine in a democratic country.

[Half Nelson]

The 2010 National Famine Commemoration is being held this Sunday the May 16 in Murrisk, Co Mayo.

This I have a problem with.
The Famine was a nationwide occurrence, yet its commemoration is being shunted to some out-of-the-way spot where it cause minimal fuss while serving to keep a few 'upstarts' happy.
The commemoration of the deaths of hundreds of thousands of our recent ancestors deserves so much more but it seems we will only acknowledge our own 'holocaust' in a most begrudging and pathetic fashion.
The RCC has not done nearly enough to commemorate the deaths of so many of its flock and the statement from the Bishops reads like an exercise in evasion - turning the Famine into a thought for the day.

Our memories of our Famine are being managed like an exercise in damage limitation and entrusting the commemoration of such an important event to a political quango will ensure we never realise the truth about ourselves.

[Sailor]

The 2010 National Famine Commemoration is being held this Sunday the May 16 in Murrisk, Co Mayo.

This I have a problem with.
The Famine was a nationwide occurrence, yet its commemoration is being shunted to some out-of-the-way spot where it cause minimal fuss while serving to keep a few 'upstarts' happy.
The commemoration of the deaths of hundreds of thousands of our recent ancestors deserves so much more but it seems we will only acknowledge our own 'holocaust' in a most begrudging and pathetic fashion.
The RCC has not done nearly enough to commemorate the deaths of so many of its flock and the statement from the Bishops reads like an exercise in evasion - turning the Famine into a thought for the day.

Our memories of our Famine are being managed like an exercise in damage limitation and entrusting the commemoration of such an important event to a political quango will ensure we never realise the truth about ourselves.

I take your point - but Mayo was particularly badly affected. Generally the Famine was a lot more severe in the western part of the country.

[Christine Murray]

Schools to honour Famine dead | BreakingNews.ie

The famine/An Gorta Mór was a terrible event in our history, but is it not crass tokenism to force school children engage in a minutes silence?

If the children could transfer this artificial anger into meaningful action on famine in Africa/Climate Change/Population control/wealth inequality, some good might come of it, but it has the appearance of blamings others for our woes.

Just as the Tony Blair apology for the Famine was false, as he murdered in Iraq, can we please not engage in this nonsense?

I don't think that its just about a minute's silence, there would have been talks and projects during
the preceeding weeks too.

I think that the minute's silence would be a cumulative event in many schools and people should ask
the kids about how they feel instead of putting the word 'forced' into the sentence. Theres nothing
wrong with increasing historical awareness - that is what education is for.

[farnaby]

Schools to honour Famine dead | BreakingNews.ie

The famine/An Gorta Mór was a terrible event in our history, but is it not crass tokenism to force school children engage in a minutes silence?

If the children could transfer this artificial anger into meaningful action on famine in Africa/Climate Change/Population control/wealth inequality, some good might come of it, but it has the appearance of blamings others for our woes.

Which is it, an insufficient token or an excessive, hate-fuelling action? Can't have it both ways.

One of the aims of it is to create "a gesture of respect and to contemplate famine and hunger worldwide" so your second point seems inappropriate.

As a small but meaningful action to get kids who know no better yet to understand the enormity of the event it's alright be me.