Part 3. The Real Green Party Prosperity

[youngdan]

It should be clear by now Ireland is going right down the crapper. Long warned of and now a reality.

However I bring great cheer.

The debts have been voided, the punt has been restored, the budget has been cut to 15 billion. The currency is sound and rising relative to the others. Huge cuts and total eliminations of some useless departments has occured. Public sector workers have been fired in droves and the rest have had their pay slashed. The Welfare State is over.
This is detailed in the first 2 parts
http://www.politics.ie/economy/68075...oint-plan.html

http://www.politics.ie/economy/72456...ise-burst.html

The single most important thing achieved is that the value of deposits in the banking system has been preserved against the certain loss that was faced before.


Now the good news of a budget of 15 billion is that only 15 billion of taxes must be paid. A lot of money but doable.

This is what it would mean.

It would that a sales tax would be sufficient to generate this revenue after a sort time but at the beginning a corporate tax would be collected. The corporate tax would quickly be phased out as sales tax rose. I will use the departments own projected figures for 2009

http://www.finance.gov.ie/documents/...084append2.pdf

I would slightly lower Vat and keep the corporate tax for a projected 15.2 billion punts.

Gone would be all personel income taxes. This would immediately put spending cash into every workers pocket. Gone would be the costs involved in it's collection. A dramatic change for businesses. This with the elimination of the minimum wage would make it greatly cheaper to hire a worker.

Gone would be all excise duties. More cash for everyone to spend and a great boost to business.

Gone would be capital gains and aquisitions tax. Maybe this would generate a boost to the financial sector when it is badly needed

Gone would be stamp duty

There would be no underground economy and there would be no licenses needed for a great number of professions like cabs, hairdressers pubs etc etc


Perhaps some here will disagree. Well come up with another solution then.


This will not happen of course because there is no leadership in Ireland, all you have are politicians.

What will happen is Ireland will default. the people in the know will have their money withdrawn and will be OK. The average person will lose everything, and I mean everything

[Dios]

It would that a sales tax would be sufficient to generate this revenue after a sort time but at the beginning a corporate tax would be collected. The corporate tax would quickly be phased out as sales tax rose. I will use the departments own projected figures for 2009

Would a sales tax not depress the economy as it would encourage people to spend as little as possible? Income taxes have the advantage that they give an incentive to the wealthy to invest their earnings in businesses which can be written off.

[youngdan]

Is the Vat at the moment not a sales tax. It is supposed to generate about 12 billion on the latest estimate. There would not be a tax over and above this

[Dios]

Is the Vat at the moment not a sales tax. It is supposed to generate about 12 billion on the latest estimate. There would not be a tax over and above this

Indeed, and that has a depressive effect on spending as well, plus knock on effects for tourism. Also you mention no licences for taxi driving or hairdressing, I'd say those are more for the public benefit than for tax revenues. You don't want mickey the molester picking up drunk teenage girls at the taxi rank when hes out on bail, or some optimist setting themselves up as a hairdresser and giving all and sundry the Johnny Rotten look. You can say the market will sort them out eventually, but the collateral damage in the meantime is too high.

[youngdan]

more more depressive than it is at the moment because it is staying the same.

As regards the cab drivers, who even knows their right names.

[Dios]

more more depressive than it is at the moment because it is staying the same.

Yeah, but a lot will change in the coming few years. A better idea might be to set up an Irish Common Investment Market (like a mini stock market with easier conditions of access) and allow monies invested in that to be written off against taxes, up to a point. That way you massively stimulate your economy, providing more jobs, providing more income taxes minus ICIM investments, providing more jobs, etc. We've a section about that on the Amhrán Nua party site there.

[chippie]

What will happen is Ireland will default. the people in the know will have their money withdrawn and will be OK. The average person will lose everything, and I mean everything

I got to ask, and its probably a stupid question, but when/if Ireland defaults, how will the average person lose everything. Is it massive tax hikes etc, or do you literally mean overnight people will lose everything.

[youngdan]

This is my opinion for what it is worth.

If Ireland defaulted and it is still using the euro as it's currency there will be some rush by each and everyone to get their money. Even in good times in a bank run there is not enough money to pay everyone as most of it is lent out.

In these times the loses of about 50 billion or whatever it is the banks have lost would have to be dealt with immediately. It would be the average person who was last to to get to the bank teller and would be out of luck.

If the Europeans decided to lend a quick 100 billion, the country could never pay it back, If it just granted 100 billion it could crash the euro. They might decide it were better that the Irish suffer the loss.

Before this happens, the government could bring back the punt, issue the amount sufficient to more or less have the same value as the euro presently but more importantly to be able to cover the deposits in the banks.

This currency would have value forced on it in the same way every currency does and that is by the legal tender laws. All transactions would take place only in punts and that creates the demand for it. The government would control the supply so they would then be able to decide it's value. The government would commit not to increase the supply and over time the value would rise compared to the other currencies whose supply would be increasing.

The depositor would have the money in the bank and he would be saved.

Thats how I see it

[chippie]

Cant fault your logic and can actually see some of it come true. If you are right, I guess the lesson is not to keep your cash in an Irish bank, but either abroad or in a subsidiary of a foreign bank. Cash should be a bit more secure.

[Dios]

If the Europeans decided to lend a quick 100 billion, the country could never pay it back, If it just granted 100 billion it could crash the euro.

In fairness 100 billion is pocket change to the eurozone...