Give and Take For Public sector Pay cuts!

[deepness]

I reckon that in real terms Civil Servants are currently taking about a 10% wage cut as it is.

Overbloated public sector wage bill??? Ah the oul sound bites with no basis in reality, try reading the OECD Report.

Boo feckin hoo..10%??? I'm currently on 50% of what i was on 2 years ago and I still have to pay the 1% levy etc...and I had the misfortune to deal with the public sector of FAS and the dole office for months before I was lucky enough to get a job, any job. Some of the things I experienced dealing with both made me sick..
I have no sympathy for any public servant and I really believe the cuts should be wide and severe. I know a few public servants and they have it far too easy imo

[meriwether2]

Then it must be a miracle Im alive. In 2003 I went into Bank and asked for A mortgage. I was only a Temporay Teacher whose contract was due for renewal or rejection every May. Got offered X amount. Went back 2 years later as a Permanent Teacher and got offered exactly the same. A friend of mine who is a Solicitor and who was earning less than me in 2003 got offered more. He has since lost his job. My family is full of Bankers and they say Banks really only look at your current account and potential for earnings.

Job security is important but I too feel the ERSI figures are nonsense and just work off an average.You generally earn less in the public sector and get no perks unless you are in FAS. I always split myself laughing when they print the average salary for a teacher. They always give this average Teacher an Honours Degree (higher Allowance) and a permanent job with full hours. I earned 10,000 Punts a Year for four years.

Any Avg figure for Teachers is always distorted by the elderly profile of its cohort.

Listen, risk is quantifiable.
The people who do it have a name. They are called actuaries.
They do it for insurance companes, investment banks, and retail banks.

If you dont get this, well, I've no more to say.

Again this does not translate into a monetary value. Being able to get oneself into debt is not a justifiable reason to cut somebody’s salary

I read this sentence over and over again. Something just didn't seem right.
You've done that cleverly though Kevin.
You've attached negative connotations to the word 'debt'.

Why not call it 'borrowing for investment purposes'? Which is what most borrowing is? Something a little more light hearted?

Suddenly the sentence 'being able to get cheaper credit in order to make investments in order to achieve a monetary return is not a justifiable reason to cut someone's salary' just doesn't have the same negative connotations, does it?

Tip of the cap to you sir though, that was nicely worded.

[DeathKnell]

Are you telling me that office workers (with Degree) earns 20-25K

Are you telling me that Office workers even NEED degrees?

I can assure you that the ESRI report will be revised accordingly.

Im sure it will, because it does not suit the 'partnership' agreement..

But you don't mind picking up the tab for the idiots in the Banking sector who where major influential factors in getting us into this mess.

B*tch away.....Princess.

Oh I do, and I will luv.. Thanks for your permission.. Ms Antoinette..

[DeathKnell]

Job security is important but I too feel the ERSI figures are nonsense and just work off an average..

Well then dont quote the OECD stats if you dont believe in reports..

[Kevin Doyle]

I read this sentence over and over again. Something just didn't seem right.
You've done that cleverly though Kevin.
You've attached negative connotations to the word 'debt'.

Why not call it 'borrowing for investment purposes'? Which is what most borrowing is? Something a little more light hearted?

Suddenly the sentence 'being able to get cheaper credit in order to make investments in order to achieve a monetary return is not a justifiable reason to cut someone's salary' just doesn't have the same negative connotations, does it?

Tip of the cap to you sir though, that was nicely worded.

Debt is a bad thing for any individual. Always was always will be, its one of the first things any lending institution looks at when an individual applies for a loan. The more debt you're in the less you can borrow etc etc. You are making the mistake of equating an ordinary indivual with a business in how they interact with banks and lending institutions, banks do not tailor lendings rates to suit ordinary individuals so how does SoT translate into cheaper credit?

[riker1969]

Listen, risk is quantifiable.
The people who do it have a name. They are called actuaries.
They do it for insurance companes, investment banks, and retail banks.

If you dont get this, well, I've no more to say.



I read this sentence over and over again. Something just didn't seem right.
You've done that cleverly though Kevin.
You've attached negative connotations to the word 'debt'.

Why not call it 'borrowing for investment purposes'? Which is what most borrowing is? Something a little more light hearted?

Suddenly the sentence 'being able to get cheaper credit in order to make investments in order to achieve a monetary return is not a justifiable reason to cut someone's salary' just doesn't have the same negative connotations, does it?

Tip of the cap to you sir though, that was nicely worded.

You give the impression you are quoting from me throughout. That is not the case.

[Oppenheimer]

I'm not being silly at all.

They do not lend because the they place a higher monetary value on Job security , they lend because that job security lessons the risk of the loan being defaulted.

Again this does not translate into a monetary value. Being able to get oneself into debt is not a justifiable reason to cut somebody’s salary.

Again, the BMA looked at SoT and dismissed it as unquantifiable (they actually stated it was irrelevant) in the last round of benchmarking. So this entire sub thread is really of no relevance what so ever.

So you ascribe a lower level of risk value rather than a monetary value? Just trying to understand.

[Rebel CNC]

Job security is important but I too feel the ERSI figures are nonsense and just work off an average.

Well of course it does - what do you expect? An 800,000 page report outlining details of every worker.

Find any report including INTO/ASTI reports and they'll work off averages...and rightly so.

Even in the midst of the benchmarking grab, no union or representative body came out and said "I know this one lad and he found it really, really difficult to get a €xxk mortgage "


It'd be like Lenihan or Harney justifying the medical card withdrawal by saying "I know this old guy and he's loaded"!!

[droghedasouth]

I just went into the bank and tried to pay my mortgage with "Job Security" - they wouldn't accept it.

Job Security means you will have an income next month and next year in order to pay the mortgage.
You should count your blessings.

[Kevin Doyle]

So you ascribe a lower level of risk value rather than a monetary value? Just trying to understand.

I dont, Banks do, in part, along with credit history, salary and any verifiable disposition toward saving.

If you lower someones salary you also lower their credit rating (the amount they can borrow) as salary is and always will be considered among the primary factors much more so than SoT.