Give and Take For Public sector Pay cuts!

[droghedasouth]

It should be noted that as well as agreeing an 11 month pay freeze Civil Servants are also enduring a 4% pay cut (in real terms) as well as the 1% levy.

Given that we did not cause this mess I think we're shouldering quite a lot of the pain.

Prices are FALLING.
Just look at the price of petrol and home heating oil.

You all got an increase last September.
My income is 50% from dollar customers and 50% from sterling customers.
I can tell you what a real pay cut feels like because I have to be competitive in both markets.

Your turn will come because there simply is no alternative.

We thought we were rich because we paid one another silly prices for houses.
We won't escape from this catastrophe by paying one another far more than anyone else in Europe.

[markeys]

Exactly how could I start a creche and keep my job? Secondly pension arrangements for the ppublic sector is not tax evasion. You know that. You might change them but current arrangements are not illegal so a bit of cop on! You are doging issue of childcare-obviously you dont pay for it yourself and why should I be forced to start one?? Suggesting I start one is hardly a coherent childcare policy for the nation? We dont have one nor even a promise of one. Im presuming you dont have kids -ask around at the cost but please be sitting down when you do.

Actaully I have one kid. I pay childcare. But unlike you I don't have the luxury of 'demanding' child care costs be lowered before I enter discussions on pay. Unlike your obscene deamands in the original post. The point, entirely lost on you, is that hundreds of thousands of workers in the private sector also pay childcare costs - but couldn't demand that they be lowered in return for them taking a paycut, as you seem to imagine your entitled to do.

I have no problem with implementing regulations on cost of childcare. But its your nausating sense of 'entitlement' to 'demand' its done before you give way on the pay issue thats outrageous.

Now either benchmarking works - both way and public pay cuts should be implemented in line with the cuts taking in place in the private sector (sure thats fair all round, isn't it?) or benchmarking was only ever looked upon by public service workers as a one way gravy ticket.

Do you not find something strange that at a time when private sector earnings are falling that benchmarking should not result in the same? Its rubbish to suggest otherwise. Is it your view that benchmarking should only occur one way?

In fact take to the streets. Go on strike for as long as you want. Not paying workers for a few months is just what the country needs. I'd be sure interested to see the reaction you receive!

[Kevin Doyle]

If it is of no value then what objection would you have to its being rescinded?

There is nothign ot rescind. Job security is not a tangible right enshrined in the terms and conditions of employment of any Civil servant. There is nothing to give up.


BTW People are losing their jobs in the PS. More are set to lose them in the coming year.

[meriwether2]

Bobbys concerns are bobbys concerns. That doesn't mean that job security has any monetary value. It doesn't and the BM authority agree with me, which at the ned of the day is all that really matters.

As for tax evasion, only a fool would try and claim it is not a part of the deficit.

No fool has tried to argue that tax evasion is not part of the deficit.

You consistently state this in order to deflect the main point - your observation that tax evasion from the private sector was a 'huge' part of the national defecit.

You're not doing so well on that, are you?

[Kevin Doyle]

No fool has tried to argue that tax evasion is not part of the deficit.

You consistently state this in order to deflect the main point - your observation that tax evasion from the private sector was a 'huge' part of the national defecit.

You're not doing so well on that, are you?

Tax evasion is a big problem in this country, the black economy especially in the construction sector was huge.

I consistently state nothing on this matter beyond the fact that tax evasion is a part of the deficit, needs to be tackled and tackled quickly. If you want to get into a semantic side argument regarding just how much it constitutes, off with you.

[meriwether2]

Tax evasion is a big problem in this country, the black economy especially in the construction sector was huge.

I consistently state nothing on this matter beyond the fact that tax evasion is a part of the deficit, needs to be tackled and tackled quickly. If you want to get into a semantic side argument regarding just how much it constitutes, off with you.

Is that someone running away from their contention that private sector tax evasion was a 'huge' part of the deficit?
(Which was part of the argument advanced by Bobby that the recession is the fault of the private sector?
Which is a sub-argument of the master argument, which is 'do not revamp the public sector in any way, shape or form?)

I believe it is.

[Kevin Doyle]

Is that someone running away from their contention that private sector tax evasion was a 'huge' part of the deficit?
(Which was part of the argument advanced by Bobby that the recession is the fault of the private sector?

Meh...I don't really care what you believe, you also believe that job security is quantifiable in monetary terms... It isn't.

Much like this horse-sh*t here

Which is a sub-argument of the master argument, which is 'do not revamp the public sector in any way, shape or form?)

I believe it is

Where have I ever said that?

[Conor]

As for the banks, firstly, I want to clarify that I would like to see most of the management fired (if they can be replaced).
As for paycuts to ban staff, thats not the worst idea.
I would assume we will see redundancies along the line there anyway, which iss ame principle.

Funny you should mention that. Have you seen this?

[meriwether2]

Meh...I don't really care what you believe, you also believe that job security is quantifiable in monetary terms... It isn't.

Kevin, I've only asked you to back up claims and assertions you have made.

Your claim was that tax evasion by the private sector was a huge part of the government deficit.

I merely asked you how huge.

You seem incapable of telling me.

I think its because you have no idea.
I think you have no idea, because you made that claim up. (note, nobody has suggested there isn't tax evasion, nor that it affects the public finances, contrary to what you keep asserting).
And I think you made that claim up because it suited your argument (the 'thrashing wildly' argument, as I like to refer to it).

Thats what I think.

[Oriel27]

can someone explain why is the dole in the south at 198 euro and due to go up to 212 euro (per week) this month, compared to 62 pound a week in the north???

yes i know different economies and all, but should the south that start cutting benifits and bring them more in line with the rest of europe? there is definately savings that can be made here.

the benifits in the south for child care, dole, etc are brilliant compared to the north.