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  1. #551
    fiannafailure fiannafailure is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Craig McInerney View Post

    In terms of the economic viability of a nuclear reactor, I was refer exclusively to the capital costs of constructing a AP1000 Nuclear reactor, which is currently the most modern and the frequently adopted model type for nearly all new constructions.

    Prices range from 4-5 billion for a medium sized AP1000 Nuclear reactor.

    I don't think we have the political will or financial solvency to be anywhere near meeting the capital construction costs.

    Regarding the empirical evidence I have been criticized about, I think France is a shinning example of the economic benefits and carbon diluting capability of a nuclear approach particularly in comparison to wind technology.
    Craig

    You are correct to zero in on the capital costs of nuclear energy, however in a world of hydrocarbons becoming scarce and very expensive, it may in the future become necessary to spend the money.

    The real problem for nuclear in Ireland is that the political establishment has not yet recovered from the Carnsore debacle, which in my opinion has influenced the way in which they have dealt with the current Corrib controversy.
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  2. #552
    GreenIsGood GreenIsGood is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by fiannafailure View Post

    A private venture which from the outset declared that it should be owned by the citizens of Ireland.

    And that remains my personal interest
    It was stated on the Frontline programme that SoI is looking for venture capital from the UK. Are you suggesting we should we not take what Prof Shvets says seriously?


    Quote Originally Posted by fiannafailure View Post

    And in certain circumstances, I would support support the concept of IROPI, Imperative Reasons of Overriding Private Interest, being used to change some of the designations.
    Fixed that for you.

    Override regulation to benefit a private entity? Now where have we heard that before ..?


    Quote Originally Posted by fiannafailure View Post
    Luckily, Spirit of Ireland do not wish to create a saline environment.
    In fact you want to build the world's largest salination plant.

    Japan built one tiny experimental saltwater hydro plant and never built another. They incorporated an elaborate leak detection system into their small plant. Clearly environmental issues are important to the Japanese. Funny, because you assert that salt is harmless.

    Quote Originally Posted by fiannafailure View Post
    Building wind energy without large scale storage is not sustainable and an environmental and economic disaster.


    That is a very extreme view. Have you explained this to Minister Ryan? I withdraw my earlier description of you as a "mouthpiece for the wind industry".
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  3. #553
    fiannafailure fiannafailure is offline

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    [quote=GreenIsGood;2678414]
    It was stated on the Frontline programme that SoI is looking for venture capital from the UK. Are you suggesting we should we not take what Prof Shvets says seriously?
    Igor stated that international finance was available, we have not pursued the venture capital route, we wish to finance the project using bonds and debt.


    Fixed that for you.

    Override regulation to benefit a private entity? Now where have we heard that before ..?
    I doubt that the EU would take that proposal seriously , should it ever become necessary, they would prefer to discuss my description.

    In fact you want to build the world's largest salination plant.
    What, how, why,

    Japan built one tiny experimental saltwater hydro plant and never built another. They incorporated an elaborate leak detection system into their small plant. Clearly environmental issues are important to the Japanese. Funny, because you assert that salt is harmless.
    Glad that you approve of the environmental credentials of our advisors.
    There are currently 8 plants in various stages of preparation worldwide, an example is here
    Managing water for peace in the Middle East

    We value the advice of JPower very highly, which is the reason that fully 30% of our projected costs are purely environmental precautions, we also take our responsibilities seriously.

    That is a very extreme view. Have you explained this to Minister Ryan? I withdraw my earlier description of you as a "mouthpiece for the wind industry".
    The Minister stated on Frontline that he supports the semi state companies, who believe that the current situation of putting large amounts of wind on the grid and building more and more gas stations as back up is quite acceptable, I remain hopeful that sense will prevail.

    The Minister is indeed in an unenviable position, lets hope that he realises that as the sole shareholder, he is the boss.
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  4. #554
    wombat wombat is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by GreenIsGood View Post
    Japan built one tiny experimental saltwater hydro plant and never built another. They incorporated an elaborate leak detection system into their small plant. Clearly environmental issues are important to the Japanese. Funny, because you assert that salt is harmless.
    Is there any evidence that saltwater reservoirs will be harmful? Our river estuaries are mostly tidal and I have not noticed the mangroves around Carrick on Suir, despite seeing flounders caught in the town. Cork harbour does not seem to be in the middle of a desert - is it more likely that the seawater reservoirs will be harmless?
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  5. #555
    myksav myksav is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by energy View Post
    The SoI plan is based on importing "cheap" electricity from the UK to refill the reservoirs.
    ?As opposed to refilling resevoirs using any excess power during off-peak times??

    Though, in times of too little wind, which isn't usual in Ireland, using off-peak from Britain which would be less expensive than peak time. Kind of like charging batteries using night-saver system.

    I presume SoI would also be using whatever excesss power the Irish generators produce off-peak as well? In the no wind scenario.

    Do you think they shouldn't think of tapping whatever source they can find depending on cost?
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  6. #556
    myksav myksav is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by wombat View Post
    Is there any evidence that saltwater reservoirs will be harmful? Our river estuaries are mostly tidal and I have not noticed the mangroves around Carrick on Suir, despite seeing flounders caught in the town. Cork harbour does not seem to be in the middle of a desert - is it more likely that the seawater reservoirs will be harmless?
    That's quite a good point. I live by a tidal estuary and the land along the river is quite fertile and covered in vegetation almost exactly the same as along any freshwater stream. What is doesn't have is the likes of giant hogweed which is toxic to humans and animals. Animals will die if they eat it, humans can get skin cancer from contact as it strips melanin from the skin allowing major UV damage.

    GreenIsGood seems to be on primarily to do personal attacks on fiannafailure (Pat).
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  7. #557
    wombat wombat is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by myksav View Post
    I live by a tidal estuary and the land along the river is quite fertile and covered in vegetation almost exactly the same as along any freshwater stream.
    I have a concern that the more fanatical environmentalists never heard of the little boy that cried wolf. I was looking at Dun Laoghaire baths the other day and all I could think of was the expression "be careful what you wish for", in that case, the rats are grateful to the conservationists. If it turns out that the seawater reservoirs present an unacceptable risk, so be it but they should be presumed innocent until there is contrary evidence.
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  8. #558
    cry freedom cry freedom is offline
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    [quote=Craig McInerney;2677837]
    Quote Originally Posted by cry freedom View Post

    In terms of the economic viability of a nuclear reactor, I was refer exclusively to the capital costs of constructing a AP1000 Nuclear reactor, which is currently the most modern and the frequently adopted model type for nearly all new constructions.

    Prices range from 4-5 billion for a medium sized AP1000 Nuclear reactor.

    I don't think we have the political will or financial solvency to be anywhere near meeting the capital construction costs.

    Regarding the empirical evidence I have been criticized about, I think France is a shinning example of the economic benefits and carbon diluting capability of a nuclear approach particularly in comparison to wind technology.
    Given the current state of our finances I would probably have to agree with you. Hopefully things will not stay like this forever and we really should be planning for the future.
    Planning, environmental impact and engineering assessment and evaluation do not cost quite so much and we should be getting on with that now.
    If the proper ground rules were laid out for a project of this size I would be very optimistic that private enterprise would do a lot of the heavy financial lifting. Private enterprise however would need certain criteria laid down in stone before they would be prepared to risk their hard cash.
    One is the reasonable assumption that they would make a return on their investment and the other is that they would not be held up with frivolous law suits or changes in planning due to new administrations coming in or duplicitous politicians caving in to green or other vested interests.
    New laws would need to be brought in making it impossible to bring legal challenges or force unreasonable and costly modifications during construction. All of this would need to be trashed out before planning and licenses would be issued. Before but not after. We don't want a repeat of the Corrib debacle.
    In America,the home of nuclear power not one plant has been built since 1974
    due to the outrageous lies and hysteria manufactured by the anti nuke brigade.What you see there is is the first sign of a great nation beginning to suffer from political grid lock. We must not let it happen here.
    I propose we hold a referendum on this important subject!!!
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  9. #559
    GreenIsGood GreenIsGood is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by wombat View Post
    Is there any evidence that saltwater reservoirs will be harmful? Our river estuaries are mostly tidal and I have not noticed the mangroves around Carrick on Suir, despite seeing flounders caught in the town. Cork harbour does not seem to be in the middle of a desert - is it more likely that the seawater reservoirs will be harmless?

    Suggestion: water your houseplants with seawater for few weeks and let us know how they get on.
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  10. #560
    GreenIsGood GreenIsGood is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by wombat View Post
    I have a concern that the more fanatical environmentalists never heard of the little boy that cried wolf. I was looking at Dun Laoghaire baths the other day and all I could think of was the expression "be careful what you wish for", in that case, the rats are grateful to the conservationists. If it turns out that the seawater reservoirs present an unacceptable risk, so be it but they should be presumed innocent until there is contrary evidence.

    Yes, damn environmentalists with their stupid regulations. I blame the EU, do you?

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kvsE0EuO5g8"]Salt Woes[/ame]
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