Time for Biological father to pay the bill

[Foghorn]

The court protects that right and that is why a father who is being denied access is adviced to apply to the courts.

Hopi, that's the best one yet. You've given me a hernia from all the laughing I have done with that one. Brilliant! I suppose that's as close to getting an admission of your being wrong as we'll ever get.

So, by extrapolation, the courts are there to affirm our rights and every time we want to exercise our rights we have to apply to the courts?

It does NOT say that a father who is being denied those rights needs to apply to the courts? As you so often ask - "can't you read?"

By law in Ireland, unmarried mothers are the sole guardians of children born outside of marriage. Unless the mother agrees to sign a statutory declaration an unmarried father must apply to the court in order to become a legal guardian of his child.

A father may apply for access whether or not he is a guardian. He can do this even if his name is not on the child's birth certificate, and even where his application for joint guardianship has been turned down.
If both guardianship and access are being applied for, then separate applications must be made, but both applications will be heard by the court at the same time.

A website that campaigns for father's right in Ireland Just Like A Man: Groups for separated fathers in Ireland growing says -

Fathers don't matter. Children are seen as the property of mothers, single or married, whereas fathers have no rights. Fathers might believe that they have rights but, on separation, suddenly discover that they are expendable.

And again back to the Citizen's Information Legal guardianship and unmarried couples-Information from CitizensInformation.ie

If a child in Ireland is born out outside of marriage, the mother is the sole guardian. [COLOR=red]The position of the unmarried father of the child is not so certain[/COLOR].

Does it get any clearer? It is obvious to everyone that you are wrong.

[Congalltee]

That's nuts! You might as well say murdering someone ensures they will never have to worry about getting shingles. There are reasonable arguments for abortion based on the rights of the mother but let's not pretend we are doing the child a favour.

You're correct, that abortion is a woman's right but there are some embryos (eg where the egg and sperm providers are so disfunctional and neglectful) where it would be better if it never became a child. Terminations should be paid for by the State if the mother chooses.

If by the time the embryo becomes a child and the mother has not mended her ways, ie is a risk of neglect, the Child should be adopted speedily to childless or same-sex couples.

[hopi watcher]

Hopi, that's the best one yet. You've given me a hernia from all the laughing I have done with that one. Brilliant! I suppose that's as close to getting an admission of your being wrong as we'll ever get.

So, by extrapolation, the courts are there to affirm our rights and every time we want to exercise our rights we have to apply to the courts?

It does NOT say that a father who is being denied those rights needs to apply to the courts? As you so often ask - "can't you read?"





A website that campaigns for father's right in Ireland Just Like A Man: Groups for separated fathers in Ireland growing says -



And again back to the Citizen's Information Legal guardianship and unmarried couples-Information from CitizensInformation.ie



Does it get any clearer? It is obvious to everyone that you are wrong.

Why oh why do ignoramous's insist on posting on matters that they have no clue of. There is a huge difference between 'guardianship' and 'access'. And once again, a father has a right to access his child. A mother cannot deny access. The court will protect the fathers right to access. The issue of 'guardianship' is extremely complex and again, as has been pointed out, the interests of the child takes precedence in all circumstances in cases that come before the court. In Irish law the natural 'guardian' is regarded as the mother in cases of seperation but this does not preclude access by the father.

[Foghorn]

You're correct, that abortion is a woman's right but there are some embryos (eg where the egg and sperm providers are so disfunctional and neglectful) where it would be better if it never became a child. Terminations should be paid for by the State if the mother chooses.

If by the time the embryo becomes a child and the mother has not mended her ways, ie is a risk of neglect, the Child should be adopted speedily to childless or same-sex couples.

Seems to me like there are a lot of considerations / criteria BEFORE you reach the welfare of the child!

[Electro]

John Waters on Newstalk now addressing the OP's hypocritical feminist BS about fathers, "child support" and "responsibility".

Newstalk 106-108fm Media Player

[Electro]

The court will protect the fathers right to access.

And the court can deny fathers rights to access, at its own arbitrary discretion.

Fathers rights do not exist. There's only what the mother "allows".

So, by extrapolation, the courts are there to affirm our rights and every time we want to exercise our rights we have to apply to the courts?

Yes, that sounds like real genuine rights, doesn't it. Observe the feminist hypocrisy and obfuscation, for there is much of it on this issue.

[Foghorn]

Why oh why do ignoramous's insist on posting on matters that they have no clue of. There is a huge difference between 'guardianship' and 'access'. And once again, a father has a right to access his child. A mother cannot deny access. The court will protect the fathers right to access. The issue of 'guardianship' is extremely complex and again, as has been pointed out, the interests of the child takes precedence in all circumstances in cases that come before the court. In Irish law the natural 'guardian' is regarded as the mother in cases of seperation but this does not preclude access by the father.

Hopi, I ask myself that same question - "why do ignoramous's insist on posting on matters that they have no clue of" - every time I read one of your posts.

Yes, I know that there is a difference between "guardianship" and "access" and the quotes I provide are clear that both must be applied for through the courts. Absolutely clear. There is no confusion or debate on this at all.

See [COLOR=#800080]http://www.amen.ie/Papers/15133.htm[/COLOR]

"Men have to apply for access for permission to see their own flesh and blood. Does the woman own the child? "The worst scenario is if the man is unmarried - he hasn't got a leg to stand on.

It doesn't get any clearer than this. See Call for rights for unmarried fathers - The Irish Times - Wed, Sep 09, 2009

At present, there are no legal obligations to give an unmarried man rights and access to his children under Irish law.

Read em and weep!

[hopi watcher]

And the court can deny fathers rights to access, at its own arbitrary discretion.

Fathers rights do not exist. There's only what the mother "allows".



Yes, that sounds like real genuine rights, doesn't it. Observe the feminist hypocrisy and obfuscation, for there is much of it on this issue.

The court can also deny a mother access. The fact is that providing there is no implecation for the well being of the child, the court will always give the father access. In all cases both parties are given a period in the hope that they will reach an agreement, however, in the absence of such an agreement, the court will decide, not the mother. And for the umnpteen time, the law and the court is only interested in the interests of the child, not the father or the mother. It is a fact that in Irish law the mother is regarded as the natural guardian however that is notr absolute, a case can be brought to show otherwise and custody has often been granted to the father where a case showed that that arrangement was in the best interests of the chiold.

[hopi watcher]

Hopi, I ask myself that same question - "why do ignoramous's insist on posting on matters that they have no clue of" - every time I read one of your posts.

Yes, I know that there is a difference between "guardianship" and "access" and the quotes I provide are clear that both must be applied for through the courts. Absolutely clear. There is no confusion or debate on this at all.

See [COLOR=#800080]http://www.amen.ie/Papers/15133.htm[/COLOR]


It doesn't get any clearer than this. See Call for rights for unmarried fathers - The Irish Times - Wed, Sep 09, 2009



Read em and weep!

You still insist on making an ass of yourself. A father cannot be denied access to his child by the mother. Get it. If she can show good reason for denying access the court will bar access, IN THE INTERESTS OF THE CHILD, NOT THE MOTHER. A court can also deny access to a mother FOR THE SAME REASON. Where there is conflict between parents, the courts decide, not either parent.

[Foghorn]

The court can also deny a mother access. The fact is that providing there is no implecation for the well being of the child, the court will always give the father access. In all cases both parties are given a period in the hope that they will reach an agreement, however, in the absence of such an agreement, the court will decide, not the mother. And for the umnpteen time, the law and the court is only interested in the interests of the child, not the father or the mother. It is a fact that in Irish law the mother is regarded as the natural guardian however that is notr absolute, a case can be brought to show otherwise and custody has often been granted to the father where a case showed that that arrangement was in the best interests of the chiold.

You're changing the subject. I have conclusively shown you to be wrong. There is no immediate right of access for an unmarried father to his children. QED!