Dublin property prices falling by €4,500 a month

[droghedasouth]

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1004/housing.html

Among many statistics, this is probably the one the most reflects the impact on Breakfast Roll man.

House prices in the commuter counties around Dublin slumped by 1.3% in the month and are now down 5.4% in the first eight months of the year.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1004/housing.html

Among many statistics, this is probably the one the most reflects the impact on Breakfast Roll man.

House prices in the commuter counties around Dublin slumped by 1.3% in the month and are now down 5.4% in the first eight months of the year.

That is if he is lucky enough to sell his house. I heard an analyst talking about the american market and the sub-prime crisis. In assessing the crisis and the effect on the value of american property, he focused on the number of houses being sold, not the prices of the houses that were sold. The fall off in sales is the real big news - people can't trade up because they can't sell.

[ibis]

Can we rely on the Census figures for empty houses.

Many people work away from home and may not have been at home when enumerators called, or even when they called back.

Nowadays neighbours may neither be willing nor able to volunteer information to callers

Well, how easy is it to tell the difference between a house that's empty because no-one lives there, and one that's empty because everyone is currently out?

Hmm. No curtains, no furniture, garden untended, leaves and other wind-blown rubbish where the occupants would normally walk, no sign of bins or bins clearly unused - temporarily empty, or vacant?

Appears on postal and TV license records as occupied, has furniture, stuff on windowsills, garden tended and rubbish swept away, bins outside or obviously used - temporarily empty, or vacant?

[stormwind]

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1004/housing.html

Among many statistics, this is probably the one the most reflects the impact on Breakfast Roll man.

House prices in the commuter counties around Dublin slumped by 1.3% in the month and are now down 5.4% in the first eight months of the year.

That is if he is lucky enough to sell his house. I heard an analyst talking about the american market and the sub-prime crisis. In assessing the crisis and the effect on the value of american property, he focused on the number of houses being sold, not the prices of the houses that were sold. The fall off in sales is the real big news - people can't trade up because they can't sell.

Also because of the extremely high number of foreclosures in the US ,there is a massive inventory of houses which the banks will sell at any price to get rid of them.
Those of good credit who make all thier mortgage payments cannot sell their houses as they are competing with for sale those who were financially reckless.
This is an impotant parrt of the contagion in the US real estate market

[droghedasouth]

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1004/housing.html

Among many statistics, this is probably the one the most reflects the impact on Breakfast Roll man.

House prices in the commuter counties around Dublin slumped by 1.3% in the month and are now down 5.4% in the first eight months of the year.

That is if he is lucky enough to sell his house. I heard an analyst talking about the american market and the sub-prime crisis. In assessing the crisis and the effect on the value of american property, he focused on the number of houses being sold, not the prices of the houses that were sold. The fall off in sales is the real big news - people can't trade up because they can't sell.

Good point.

It is a terrible pity that we have no estate agents that are listed on the Irish Stock Exchange. Their trading statemnts, profit warnings etc. would be a wonderful insight.

Am I right when I seem to recall an estate agent was listed say 5-10 years ago?

[theyshootPDsdontthey]

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1004/housing.html

Among many statistics, this is probably the one the most reflects the impact on Breakfast Roll man.

House prices in the commuter counties around Dublin slumped by 1.3% in the month and are now down 5.4% in the first eight months of the year.

That is if he is lucky enough to sell his house. I heard an analyst talking about the american market and the sub-prime crisis. In assessing the crisis and the effect on the value of american property, he focused on the number of houses being sold, not the prices of the houses that were sold. The fall off in sales is the real big news - people can't trade up because they can't sell.

Good point.

It is a terrible pity that we have no estate agents that are listed on the Irish Stock Exchange. Their trading statemnts, profit warnings etc. would be a wonderful insight.

Am I right when I seem to recall an estate agent was listed say 5-10 years ago?

Yep, Ferry Sh1tzgerald

[returning officer]

Apart form the exchequer returns (see below) on Stamp duty is there any published material on the number of house sales/activity as opposed to mere average prices?

"Reflecting the impact of the property slowdown, stamp duties were 13.8% below target - €401m lower, while the figure for capital gains taxes was €101m below forecasts."

[droghedasouth]

Apart form the exchequer returns (see below) on Stamp duty is there any published material on the number of house sales/activity as opposed to mere average prices?

"Reflecting the impact of the property slowdown, stamp duties were 13.8% below target - €401m lower, while the figure for capital gains taxes was €101m below forecasts."

Can anyone find a breakdown on stamp duty to see how much relates to the housing market.

There is for instance stamp duty on buying shares and I think there was a revenue case a few years ago that extended it to related transactions.

Am I right when I seem to recall an estate agent was listed say 5-10 years ago?

Sherry Fitzgerald floated a few years ago with Garrett's son at the helm. I am not sure how they have done since. Gunnes sold out to CBRE in the last couple of years too.

I expect the vast majority of stamp duty relates to property although stamp duty does also include duty on stock transfers and on debit cards and so forth. However "property" also includes commerical property and development property so it is hard to gauge the effect on residential property alone.

[droghedasouth]

Stamp duty on shares is 1%.

According to the ISE 2007 First Half Report:

Record half year for equity turnover - trading in equities on the Irish Stock Exchange in the first half of 2007 was €102 billion, up 55% over the same period in 2006.

That would suggest a maximum of €1.02 billion in Q1+Q2, so say a maximum of €1.5 billion up to the end of Q3.
I imagine a substantial proportion is resold before stamp duty is due so the real figure may only be €0.5 - 0.75 billion.
It still is a substantial part of the € 2.5 total stamp duty raised to the end of Q3.

Suggests that the residential portion of stamp duty has fallen off a cliff.