Who should take most of the blame...

[Phinaeus]

...for the mess that is our health service? Harney? Drumm? A.N. Other?

[Captain Con O'Sullivan]

Whichever guru the private health industry has assigned to Mary, I should imagine. I strongly suspect that the Irish Health Service as well as the NHS in the UK are being managed deliberately into decline so that Ministers can announce that they've solved the problem by attracting private funds into the service.

Which is privatisation by the back door. Anybody know whether Harney has any contacts with the private health lobby?

[Phinaeus]

Whichever guru the private health industry has assigned to Mary, I should imagine. I strongly suspect that the Irish Health Service as well as the NHS in the UK are being managed deliberately into decline so that Ministers can announce that they've solved the problem by attracting private funds into the service.

Which is privatisation by the back door. Anybody know whether Harney has any contacts with the private health lobby?

In other words, in your view Drumm is at best Harney's stooge, at worst an enabler? Personally, I believe he needs to accept more responsibility for the Frankenstein that is the HSE (admittedly, not his creation).

[jpc]

When you consider there are at least 70% more administrators employed than necessary.
Many of them 800 I believe were pushed up a few grades also.
That begs the question, how many are actually contributing anything of worth?
How many are hiding out of harms way?
How many are power hungry nutters that are obstructing worthwhile initiatives?

[toxic avenger]

Wait now, the names are on the tip of my tongue...

[Phinaeus]

When you consider there are at least 70% more administrators employed than necessary.
Many of them 800 I believe were pushed up a few grades also.
That begs the question, how many are actually contributing anything of worth?
How many are hiding out of harms way?
How many are power hungry nutters that are obstructing worthwhile initiatives?

Agree. But who should take the rap for that, Harney or Drumm? My own feeling is that most of the blame lies with Drumm. When he accepted the job of HSE CEO some years ago, he should have realised that he was taking on a job for which he was singularly unqualified. Mind you, Harney as his employer should have realised that as well. They should both be sacked - and no golden handshakes.

[FakeViking]

Agree. But who should take the wrap for that, Harney or Drumm? My own feeling is that most of the blame lies with Drumm. When he accepted the job of HSE CEO some years ago, he should have realised that he was taking on a job for which he was singularly unqualified. Mind you, Harney as his employer should have realised that as well. They should both be sacked - and no golden handshakes.

IIRC, part of Drumm's contract is that he can waltz back in to his old job as a consultant (and apparently was quite good at, strange as it may seem). Nice little earner, eh?

[Question R24U]

Who is to blame for the failings of out health service?

1. The voters.
Who fought tooth and nail for parochialism over excellence. They send back TDs from 43 constituencies who want the best for them, but to hell with the overall situation. There is a bottle-neck in A&E as people continue to by-pass their doctors or clinics.

2. Every health service worker and their lack of flexility.
There is no percentage in attacking nurses. But on an OECD crude leaguetable, we have well above average number of nurses such that a 35 hour week is almost possible. Doctors being paid more than the Taoiseach is a tad nuts but so too is their fact that it took over 4 years to negotiate a new contract whereby they would be expected to work after 5pm or on weekends. For a operation to proceed, there must be nurses, doctors, and an available bed for reaons best known to those who run the health service at a ground level - that does not always happen.

3. Gutless Ministers prior to Harney.

4. An agressive press who will devour any politician for the failings of others.

5. Drumm, he is in charge of the administrative frankenstein.

6. The whole political system whereby any accountability is avoided.

[robert151410]

I spoke top a consultant the other day. She is earning 170k pa and is convined that 220k new salary will be paid. This is insanity.

[Fr. Hank Tree]

Who is to blame for the failings of out health service?

1. The voters.
Who fought tooth and nail for parochialism over excellence. They send back TDs from 43 constituencies who want the best for them, but to hell with the overall situation. There is a bottle-neck in A&E as people continue to by-pass their doctors or clinics.

2. Every health service worker and their lack of flexility.
There is no percentage in attacking nurses. But on an OECD crude leaguetable, we have well above average number of nurses such that a 35 hour week is almost possible. Doctors being paid more than the Taoiseach is a tad nuts but so too is their fact that it took over 4 years to negotiate a new contract whereby they would be expected to work after 5pm or on weekends. For a operation to proceed, there must be nurses, doctors, and an available bed for reaons best known to those who run the health service at a ground level - that does not always happen.

3. Gutless Ministers prior to Harney.

4. An agressive press who will devour any politician for the failings of others.

5. Drumm, he is in charge of the administrative frankenstein.

6. The whole political system whereby any accountability is avoided.

So basically everyone except the minister