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  1. #1
    Breanainn Breanainn is offline

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    Where is the liberal pro-life perspective?

    By and large, I tend to have a liberal political perspective, voting for various centre-left parties and the same-sex marriage referendum. Yet I also have reservations on the proposed Repeal of the Eighth Amendment, on the grounds that it would seem impossible to frame a piece of legislation on the topic that couldn't be interpreted more broadly. Those currently leading the pro-life campaign, such as Cora Sherlock and Ronan Mullen repel through their conservative ideologies, so surely more centrist campaigners have to emerge on the No side?
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  2. #2
    The Eagle of the Ninth The Eagle of the Ninth is offline

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    Dont you think that should tell you something, h'mmmm .....
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  3. #3
    The_SR The_SR is online now

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    You can't be liberal and anti abortion in the strict sense of the word.

    Most liberal folk who are anti abortion personally would want the 8th repealed on freedom grounds.

    The 8th in its current form is barbaric and only the O'Taliban will fight to retain it
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  4. #4
    midlander12 midlander12 is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Breanainn View Post
    By and large, I tend to have a liberal political perspective, voting for various centre-left parties and the same-sex marriage referendum. Yet I also have reservations on the proposed Repeal of the Eighth Amendment, on the grounds that it would seem impossible to frame a piece of legislation on the topic that couldn't be interpreted more broadly. Those currently leading the pro-life campaign, such as Cora Sherlock and Ronan Mullen repel through their conservative ideologies, so surely more centrist campaigners have to emerge on the No side?
    So what if it is 'interpreted more broadly'? Even the Eighth Amendment was, famously. You can only vote on what's on the ballot paper.

    I consider there is a valid debate to be had about whether abortion should be available on demand/request or whether this should be restricted to certain situations (rape, incest, threat to mother's health and severe abnormality of the foetus being the most frequent ones raised). However, the debate in Ireland is going to be whether abortion should be available AT ALL and the pro-life crowd and the RCC even oppose it where the mother's life is in danger (though they would probably try to call it something else in these circumstances). This is a profoundly anti-liberal stance and within that definition of 'pro-life', any hope of a 'liberal perspective' is simply moot.
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  5. #5
    ger12 ger12 is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_SR View Post
    You can't be liberal and anti abortion in the strict sense of the word.

    Most liberal folk who are anti abortion personally would want the 8th repealed on freedom grounds.

    The 8th in its current form is barbaric and only the O'Taliban will fight to retain it
    Such a violent act against another human being isn't liberal. It's barbaric, a species that would engage in such acts for convenience and in the name of choice.

    My liberal atheist feminist voice isn't alone either.
    Last edited by ger12; 9th September 2017 at 09:41 PM.
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  6. #6
    Erudite Caveman Erudite Caveman is offline

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    I simply don't buy this argument that you can't be liberal and anti-abortion. Freedom to abort 'just because' isn't a freedom. There is a time and a place for abortion, but the choice argument? Nah.
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  7. #7
    RadicalJacobin RadicalJacobin is offline

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    There is no such thing as a liberal pro-eight stance. On this issue you are in the conservative camp. That does't necessarily mean that you must now be conservative on all issues, uniformity and dogmatic thought has never really done anyone any favours.
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  8. #8
    ger12 ger12 is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by RadicalJacobin View Post
    There is no such thing as a liberal pro-eight stance. On this issue you are in the conservative camp. That does't necessarily mean that you must now be conservative on all issues, uniformity and dogmatic thought has never really done anyone any favours.
    BS.

    You can not only be liberal and pro life, you can be atheist and feminist pro life too.
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  9. #9
    Ratio Et Fides Ratio Et Fides is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_SR View Post
    You can't be liberal and anti abortion in the strict sense of the word.

    Most liberal folk who are anti abortion personally would want the 8th repealed on freedom grounds.

    The 8th in its current form is barbaric and only the O'Taliban will fight to retain it
    I'm against genital piercings personally but I would allow them on freedom grounds.

    On what grounds are you against abortion personally?
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  10. #10
    Half Nelson Half Nelson is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breanainn View Post
    By and large, I tend to have a liberal political perspective, voting for various centre-left parties and the same-sex marriage referendum. Yet I also have reservations on the proposed Repeal of the Eighth Amendment, on the grounds that it would seem impossible to frame a piece of legislation on the topic that couldn't be interpreted more broadly. Those currently leading the pro-life campaign, such as Cora Sherlock and Ronan Mullen repel through their conservative ideologies, so surely more centrist campaigners have to emerge on the No side?
    What's Cora Sherlock's conservative ideology?
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