Between 1895 and 1914 Ireland was under British rule and neither Fine Gael nor Fianna Fáil were in power, and as a matter of fact neither existed during that time. The OP wants to use the suffering of people from the period of British occupation as political ammunition to attack the two most popular parties in the state. The title of this thread proves this.
There is no denying the an unfortunate minority were, like in many other western European countries, subjected to horrendous abuse and this cannot be defended. To attribute this tragedy to a "counter revolution" by some mysterious right wing cabal though is complete unhistorical nonsense and anyone with even half a brain wouldn't take it seriously.
The Catholic Church always sided with the establishment, British or Irish, to the extent that those opposed to those establishments were threatened with and were excommunicated. Their insidious influence continued throughout the revolutionary period and beyond culminating in the Free State affording said influence an ingrained special position at the heart of all aspects of that State; the results of which we are still living with. So the argument 'that was then and this is now' doesn't cut it.
And what is your experience of the institutions and the religious orders. Got a relative as a member?
I have no love for any religious orders and consider it a curse on humanity and spending my school years under the Christian Brothers only strengthened my disdain for religion.
My issue is with this claim that Dev was crying over Hitler, Irish neutrality was a lie as the allies were always escorted back to Northern Ireland to rejoin the war effort while the Germans found themselves detained. You might disagree with how he did it but for the most part Dev kept Ireland safe and stood up to Churchill's bullying tactics when the English were looking to get the ports back.
That's rich coming from a guy whose party leader broke into tears when he heard of the death of Hitler and the utter destruction of Nazi Germany. And don't try and attach the Sinn Fein label to me, you hypocrite.
Oh FGS. I'll pass this off as a momentary lapse from an otherwise honest poster.
The New York Times, under the heading ‘Mr de Valera’s regrets’ wrote that de Valera may have merely been following ‘what he believed to be the protocol required of a neutral state’. However, the editorial stated caustically: ‘Considering the character and the record of the man for whose death he was expressing grief. And DeValera then set about forming legislation to punish Irish soldiers who had opted to fight and beat the Nazis. Those are the actions of a grief stricken man lashing out at those who defeated Hitler and the Nazi menace.
What a disgustingly dishonest post. And from someone who I thought was a credible source about the kind of industrial schools my father suffered in.
And the context of the society can frame it all, but that's the thing, bar alcoholism or sadism any beating of children at home was within limits as not to cause severe harm. That context still can't provide a setting for the level of savagery practiced by the religious orders which was willingly ignored by the political establishment at the time.
Add to this the number of victims still living without justice, and we can't play this down in the context of history.
I'm glad you agree on the importance of context, and by the way I'm not trying to 'play down' anything. The victims should be compensated, and that compensation should come from the RCC at least as much as the State. My point is that child labour and brutality were the norm is our deeply backward society at the time and I find your statement that 'bar alcoholism or sadism any beating of children at home was within limits as not to cause severe harm' remarkable in the extreme. But to describe the system as 'FFG's Catholic Rape Machine', implying that other parties (yours?) would have acted differently, is simply the stuff of fantasy.
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