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  1. #5311
    lostexpectation lostexpectation is online now

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  2. #5312
    Des Quirell Des Quirell is online now
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    I lost a friend - wonderful woman - some years ago. She and her husband were very experienced ramblers and well equipped. With everything except GPS with sufficient detail. That was a matter which was the subject of a court action between two bidders. Disgraceful and disgusting stuff.
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  3. #5313
    Orbit v2 Orbit v2 is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by lostexpectation View Post
    "Be informed that while all care and attention was taken in the production of this chart and the information depicted is drawn from the most reliable sources, the IAA makes no warranty to its accuracy or completeness and disclaims all or any liability.
    So, "our maps and charts may actually be useless, and we take no responsibility for them". Extraordinary thing to say really.
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  4. #5314
    TheField TheField is offline

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    "Be informed that while all care and attention was taken in the production of this chart and the information depicted is drawn from the most reliable sources, the IAA makes no warranty to its accuracy or completeness and disclaims all or any liability. The information is useful for orientation, navigation and general visualisation of terrain but it does not guarantee clearance above terrain or man-made obstacles. Users should at all times adhere to visual flight rules and the relevant rules of the air."

    This is a perfectly normal and reasonable qualifying statement. We may yet see that an over reliance on digital navigational technology and a disconnect with traditional charts and flying practices contributed to this tragedy.
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  5. #5315
    TheField TheField is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by lostexpectation View Post
    The fact that Skellig Michael was also reportedly missing may be significant in pointing towards the source of the problem. There are two obvious sources for the digital terrain data required by the early warning system a) Ordnance Survey Ireland digital database created in the 1990s and b) the NASA SRTM datasets, Shuttle Radar Topography Mission was flown in 2000 and captured the surface detail of the bulk of the landmass on earth.

    The publicly available data for both Black Rock and Skellig Michael are missing from both above sources but Skellig Michael is indeed captured on the OSI data. Whereas Skellig Michael appears to be missing from the publicly available SRTM data, although it would certainly appear on the raw data captured by the shuttle mission. In their released data they tend to omit offshore islands of a certain distance and size from the main coast. So that might point to the NASA data as a source for the Honeywell systems. Although you'd think that a large company like this might have access to the full datasets.
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  6. #5316
    darkhorse darkhorse is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheField View Post
    "Be informed that while all care and attention was taken in the production of this chart and the information depicted is drawn from the most reliable sources, the IAA makes no warranty to its accuracy or completeness and disclaims all or any liability. The information is useful for orientation, navigation and general visualisation of terrain but it does not guarantee clearance above terrain or man-made obstacles. Users should at all times adhere to visual flight rules and the relevant rules of the air."

    This is a perfectly normal and reasonable qualifying statement. We may yet see that an over reliance on digital navigational technology and a disconnect with traditional charts and flying practices contributed to this tragedy.

    Its absolutely disgusting that they should revert to the small print in an electronic map to absolve themselves of responsibility in these deaths - at such an early stage. These civil servants are diving for cover now - shame on them.
    And I would include the AAIU who failed to issue a safety warning about the known hazards not included in navigational charts from years earlier.
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  7. #5317
    Sweet Darling Sweet Darling is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by lostexpectation View Post
    They would be neglecting there duty if they failed to investigate all aspects of the tragedy as it might help save lives in the future. would you agree.?
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  8. #5318
    Sweet Darling Sweet Darling is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by darkhorse View Post
    Its absolutely disgusting that they should revert to the small print in an electronic map to absolve themselves of responsibility in these deaths - at such an early stage. These civil servants are diving for cover now - shame on them.
    And I would include the AAIU who failed to issue a safety warning about the known hazards not included in navigational charts from years earlier.
    Somebody messed up, who, we will find out at the release of the report.
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  9. #5319
    darkhorse darkhorse is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sweet Darling View Post
    Somebody messed up, who, we will find out at the release of the report.
    Not if its the people writing the report
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  10. #5320
    WayOutWest WayOutWest is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Round tower View Post
    If the listened and allowed the local fishermen go out with their trawlers and nets the first day and search where the locals wanted to search, ir would have saved a lot of wait and anguish for the families of the missing 2 crew members.
    That's the trouble with so many things in this country, we have so many experts who in the end know very little. The real experts are the fishermen who work in those areas. Local knowledge should never be dismissed.
    Lives have been lost around the North Mayo coast in the past through the interference of 'experts' who failed to listen to locals.
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