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  1. #10251
    Ellen Ripley Ellen Ripley is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    And in the past having large families led to famine and in the 20th century to huge numbers of Irish people having to Flee Ireland .... That was good for Ireland then?
    You're not suggesting that large families caused the famine, seriously?
    British economic and social policy, which led to over-reliance on one crop, caused famine.
    This is acknowledged by all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Right - so people with 6 sons can keep increasing their farm size by 6 to keep farm sizes stable when the farm is divided up .... I see, said the blind man ....
    The cash earned from seasonal migrant labour by older children helped to pay the ever-increasing rent.
    Part of the vicious cycle imposed by the regime, where if there was any appearance of increased prosperity, led to the 'pig kept hidden under the bed'...

    Quote Originally Posted by Cruimh View Post
    Think about it. How much labour can the family get out of one of the two adult members if she spends most of her time pregnant or trying to raise a huge family? How much labour can the family get out of children - especially as many of them die before the age of 5. And of course if five sons do survive to adulthood, the far then had to be divided in five ....
    Lots--they were tough times, children worked, everybody worked.
    Women slaved constantly on the land and in the home while pregnant, immediately before giving birth, and whilst lactating, often with a baby inside the shawl.
    The 'old' and older children helped raise the youngest ones, baked bread and boiled the enormous amounts of spuds needed to keep the hens and feed the pig. (if they were lucky enough to have pigs and hens, but then....see above)
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  2. #10252
    Lumpy Talbot Lumpy Talbot is offline

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    Ah the good old days when the priest was the only aristocracy that wintered in Ireland. The squalid large families in the urban ghetto.

    Biddable. Biddable.
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  3. #10253
    Ellen Ripley Ellen Ripley is offline
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    Come off it--nobody is claiming that they were "The good old days"; people were downtrodden by those with power and authority--including that of the Church hierarchy.

    But they were good people--better than many today--and they don't deserve to have their memory besmirched by internet clowns without a clue claiming that the number of children they had caused their misfortunes.
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  4. #10254
    Ellen Ripley Ellen Ripley is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calculusmadeeasy View Post
    They wouldn't have survived. Until the advent of mechanised/automated processes, agrarian/rural societies produced large families for that very reason, viz., survival.

    They couldn't send the childer down the chippy for batter burger and chips if they ran out of grain.

    That's something you don't appear to understand.
    Have they any idea what 'labour-intensive' actually means in practice, how back-breakingly tough it really was?

    To manually save a meadow of grass/ field of oats in order to feed livestock over a Winter?
    Never mind to manage to have a surplus to sell for cash, in order to buy paraffin, candles and flour, which was basically all they purchased.

    Mowing, turning, saving, bringing in, loading, stacking, and threshing--for even a few cattle, or fowl?

    They've never had to cut or save turf either, that's for sure.. (and that wasn't even considered a 'crop', as the weather did some of the work)
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  5. #10255
    Lumpy Talbot Lumpy Talbot is offline

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    Makes you wonder how many children Ireland has missed out on because of the sheer number of priests and nuns it produced.

    As we all know ironically enough despite their organisation's interest in a high birth rate they were the first to practice a conscious form of contraception in the country. They called it 'philosophy' though when everyone knows it was down to the church wanting inheritances rather than any priest's family getting at it.
    Last edited by Lumpy Talbot; 14th January 2017 at 06:07 PM.
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  6. #10256
    Lumpy Talbot Lumpy Talbot is offline

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    And some of the RCC's supporters have the neck to refer to the 'abortion industry' when their own church has discouraged children among priests for centuries so it stands a better chance of getting at any money they might have either in the form of inheritances from the priest's families or donations from same.

    And then condemns corporatism and materialism. It would make a cat laugh.
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  7. #10257
    Calculusmadeeasy Calculusmadeeasy is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ellen Ripley View Post
    Have they any idea what 'labour-intensive' actually means in practice, how back-breakingly tough it really was?

    To manually save a meadow of grass/ field of oats in order to feed livestock over a Winter?
    Never mind to manage to have a surplus to sell for cash, in order to buy paraffin, candles and flour, which was basically all they purchased.

    Mowing, turning, saving, bringing in, loading, stacking, and threshing--for even a few cattle, or fowl?

    They've never had to cut or save turf either, that's for sure.. (and that wasn't even considered a 'crop', as the weather did some of the work)
    I'm afraid not. Far too accustomed to luxury; setting the world to rights from a temperature controlled environment, feet up, steaming hot mug of horlicks in hand. Nonetheless it's fascinating observing various personalities reject facts because they hate the RCC. Petal's idea about small holdings was interesting. However, it sounds like she forgot that towns and cities back then (and now) were fed by the country folk.

    Then they get all tetchy when western society is referred to as decadent.

    "Large families caused the famine."

    Propaganda 101 [cue Lampy make a predictable jibe about RCC propaganda etc. etc. ad nauseam ]
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  8. #10258
    Lumpy Talbot Lumpy Talbot is offline

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    What size families do priests and nuns produce on average?
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  9. #10259
    Calculusmadeeasy Calculusmadeeasy is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lumpy Talbot View Post
    What size families do priests and nuns produce on average?
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  10. #10260
    Lumpy Talbot Lumpy Talbot is offline

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    I knew there was something different about their physiologies but I never expected that. Are they aliens?
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