New Prison - who benefits??

[northdub]

I live around 4 miles from the site for the proposed new prison. Firstly the taxpayer has been swindled again. 30 million for a farm worth 5 million. A totally unserviced site which will cost at least another 30 million to add sewage treatment, mains water, infrastructure etc etc. And then a few hundred million to build the prison. So who benefits from this deal? Not the taxpayer certainly. The prisoners and their families. OK they might get better conditions but miles away from their families with no public transport?? Mountjoy is ideally suited as 75% of the prisoners are from Dublin 1, 2, 3 and 5. The residents of the area - will they benefit? The farmer will obviously - how about his brother in law Senator Joe O'Toole who helped negotiate the sale? I daresay with 30 million in his back pocket the farmer can show his gratitude to the good senator. The big benificiaries are likely to be those people who own unserviced land between the M50 and this site. The Government (taxpayer) will foot the bill to bring the services out to the site thereby increasing hugely the value of sites owned by property developers. Among these developers is surprise surprise one M. Baily. A man not afraid to put money in envelopes and toast his FF friends at their tent at the Galway races.

And the man who made it all possible - Mr PD himself Michael McDowell, from the party who were going to clean up politics and act as watchdog for Fianna Fail.

[pluralist]

Bailey was named in the Tribunal Report.

In Ireland, as you imply, there is no punishment for corruption.

[northdub]

But are we to blame ourselves for sitting back and allowing it to continue? I was most surprised by Senator Joe O'Toole's role in this. I really believed he was a genuine honest person. Now it turns out he is as corrupt as the rest of them. Not only was he related to to the guy who sold the farm but the guy from Gunne's who handled the deal on behalf of the Department of Justice is also a cousin of Joe O'Tooles. Is there any such thing as a 'clean' politician in Ireland?

[hiker]

I'm a north dub and a PD and you have made valid points about the sale of the land to the Office of Public Works staff. These people have been found wanting in other deals and they seem to be incompetant.

However, I do not know Joe O'Toole personally but I've always tought him to be of the utmost integrity and honesty as a Senator.
As a brother-in-law, well, he appears to have done well for his relative but I doubt there is any real corruption

This deal smacks of the South Wharf deal in the docks. A loophole found and exploited but no corruption.

[northdub]

but if Joe O'Toole has nothing to hide why did he lie repeatedly? He told newspapers, radio and local people that he knew nothing about the deal until a couple of days before it was made public. When he knew that information obtained under FOI was going to reveal his part of the negotiations he then decided to come clean to a local paper. He is writing to local residents telling them about his meetings with McDowell, how he is seeking extra security, a sealed road and local jobs as part of the deal. McDowell won't meet with the residents group.... He says he has nothing to gain from the deal and his property is surrounded on three sides by the prison site. Who in their right minds would believe that he is not going to receive a backhander from his brother in law?? He will retire back to Dingle (An Daingean) with a big fat wad of cash and not a care in the world. If he had nothing to hide he would have admitted his part in the deal from day one. The guy is as corrupt as the rest of them.

[hiker]

Well the truth will out but you know as well as I do that there arn't enought 'Voters' in the area to make a political impact. Even if O'Toole is found to be wanting(which I doubt)the decision to buy the place rests with the fools in the OPW.
O'Toole may be guilty of nothing more than greed.
And thats not illegal.

[northdub]

But I guess what gets to me is that O'Toole always portrayed the image of Mr. clean and wonderful. Anyone steps out of line and there he is - putting the boot in. I have not real objection to him being a greedy so and so who put his family before his social conscience - just wish he wouldn't pretend to be otherwise.

I am surprised you admit to being a PD!! Actually I used to be a bit of a PD fan until it became a one man show. Its the McDowell party now. In fact if we are not careful he will declare himself the all powerful emperor of Ireland.

[hiker]

I have to admit, I hate doing business with family myself. O'Toole just never struck me as the crooked type but maybe he felt 'obliged' to help out the sisters hubby and quite possably against his better judgement.

As for the PD's being a one man show, well you have to admit McDowell knows how to use media. He's better than most at providing a decent soundbyte and he's not afraid to be controversial. I admire that in the man.
Where other jump on the bandwagon, McDowell is usually driving the shagging thing

[northdub]

yep driving it alright and he will drive it right over anyone who gets in his way. He has so much to say to the media he is bound to get himself into big trouble one of these days. I'd say Bertie is glad that McD does all the talking - less chance of him getting caught with his foot in his mouth. Well at least McD looks after his own constituents. Not like the apalling Brian Lenihan. He is still getting his father's vote but I think eventually will see that he is not deserving of that vote. Anyway lets hope McD eventually realises that the OPW and Dept of Justice made a huge mistake buying that site before he hands over the balance of money.

[DaveDublin]

Middle Class N I M B Y I S M - that's what you are about - nothing less.

All the arguments here about value for money etc etc are secondry. The main point is that you dont want a prison in your area.


The people of Phibsboro, Drumcondra etc etc live onthe doorstep of a prison without problem. It wont be a problem for you either.


You live in a community and a society - not just an economy.