Gormley leaving Cabinet

[hammer]

Has he not gone yet ?

I stepped in again, learning to dance at Lanigans ball.

Jobs & pensions for the boys. No wonder they stuck with FF like glue. No wonder they backed NAMA & recapitalisation when a child could see that it would cost us billions.

Weren`t they in Government in 2007 when Bertie was spoofing through his teeth, and let him have a big send off. What were they doing when BIFFO was doing his Irish tour singing in all the pubs & clubs when the economy was sliding.

Did the Greens insist on the Dail returning from their summer holidays early.........gobbers

[Alembic]

[QUOTE=OceanFrog;2500272]

Alembic, I think its only fair that you declare your colours here. Are you a member or supporter of any political party?

First off Ocean Frog, thanks for the illumination and the advice. I've been pondering it.......

"Am I now or have I ever been...?" How I plead in relation to that charge is that that I hold a third-level qualification in public administration ('the mechanics of the real government') and I have an interest in politics ( the dynamics of governments that come and go). Here endeth my confessio.

I would advise you to look at what the EU Commission have really said about NAMA. We had nominal fiscal sovereignety in this state from 1979 until 29 September 2008. Since 29 September 2008, we are a bankrupt polity that is allowed to continue 'trading' ( making social welfare payments, providing health services, paying puiblic sector wages) by the grace and favour of the the EU/ ECB. NAMA ( despite its frankly quite beserk elements) is the principal rason we are allowed as a state to continiue while insolvent - and anyone who's received a social welfare payment, availed of the public health sevices or drawn a public sector wage ( whether for vital front-line work, or for 'swingling the lead' in HSE or Local Authorigty management) has reason to be damn grarteful that NAMA is there.



Also have a look at what Arthur Doohan (GP member) has to say about NAMA
If Arthur, bless him, is your authority on the National Asset Management Agency, then I expect it'll be a while before you 'cop' what's really going on in the fiscal/monetary nexus of this 27 member co-federal experiment in pooled sovereignty.


You should also read some of what Morgan Kelly has to say on the subject.

I am, wholeheartedly, a 'Morgankelly-ite'. I have a "Morgan Rocks" tee-shirt (and he's very easy on the eye!)


"Green fingerprints" on NAMA? That new tax rate on development land, not just new developmnt land, but 'turnover' development land; is it a McGreevy-esque 20%? No its not, its a thoroughly Green 80%. There's a fingerprint.


And what about the bank guarantee? What would've been the advantage of crystalllising the loses on 28 September 2008?



What about the recap of the criminals in Anglo Irish Bank? OK, it has taken me a while to get back to you but, Alan Dukes a criminal???!!!



Gormley and the entire Green PP voted confidence in Willy O'Dea when they knew he was guilty. Absolutely not so! Thank Christ candidate Summary Justice Ocean Frog never accidentally got elected to the legislature!
Summary justice - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


perhaps I missed the bit where Gormley called for his resignation (or even criticised him). Perhaps you could link me to where Gormley did this? Do we have a Minister O'Dea today?

And there you go.


Finally, FF came out of the 2007 General Election with 78 seats, and let's assume one of their TDs wouldn't have turned down the Ceann Comhairle's job; that's 77 where 83 votes are needed to win a Dáil vote. What stops a non-Fianna Fáiler from putting together a non-Fianna Fáil government in those circumstances isn't a grasp of fundamental mathematics ( 166 divided by 2 equals.......), It's political skill and will. And Enda pulled up short, unlike John Bruton, who showed a bit of bottle in 1994. So I think Enda hasn't got it and I think the Greens realised that in 2007 when Bertie called and said "Howye's lads. I was thinkin' maybe, ye's'd be in the guvvinment, aah, what d'ye's think yerselves? Givvus a call back. I'll be in Fagins"

[Tomas Mor]

You are forgetting all the FF gene pool independents. And Gormley is no losss, remember he said on Frontline to a young girl who is in negative equity that she should have known better than to buy a house in an estate in Kildare named waterways. Imagine that frm minister for environment. Out out out in your musical chairs, what is in line for Paul Gogarty

[Alembic]

what is in line for Paul Gogarty

OK, reading back, I gotta admit I'm coming across, even to myself as a GP apologist. And it's not that. It's just that I can't accept that the members of the GP parliamentary turned into baby-eating spawn of the antichrist, just because Bertie manoevered them into government. And what I mean by that is that once Bertie said "There's a place for ye's in government", it was either accept it or sit mute for five years, afraid to squeak for fear of Dermot Ahern, Willie O'Dea etc braying "What are ye's on about? Ye's were offered seat in cabinet".

As for GoGo, Who the bloody hell knows? He does seem to be a genuine eccentric. If he was in the mould of Ken Livingstone, he might be Mayor of Dublin material, but the Greens being such a toxic brand right now, that's not going to happen.

Possibly, he's sufficiently clientilist ( and of course the Greens disapprove of clientilism) to hang on as a constituency TD in Dublin Mid West, but I can't see it.

Many posters to p.ie have a reasonably clear fix on what their income source will most likely be in 3 years time: I'm guessing none of the GP parliamentarians, bar the Louth publican, have a clue in that regard, and for those of them short of pension age, with young families, I'm sure that is a real stress - not as stressful as redundancy, unemployment, negative equity, dependance on social or supplementary welfare and the threat of repossession (also the aftermath of flooding and the effect of the prolonged period of sub-zero night-time temperatures on the homeless), but stressful nonetheless.

And they are decision-makers and stress affects the decision-making function: none of them inherited seats from daddy, like Deputies Cowen, Coughlan, Lenihan, Lenihan eile, Kitt, Andrews, Andrews eile, Calleary, Collins, Flynn, Hanafin, Haughey, O'Rourke, Power, Enda Kenny, Enright, Deasy, Sherlock, Commissioner Geoghegan Quinn etc.

Gormley to leave cabinet? I'm guessing yes he will - and will announce it at the Green Party convention.

[OceanFrog]

"Green fingerprints" on NAMA? That new tax rate on development land, not just new developmnt land, but 'turnover' development land; is it a McGreevy-esque 20%? No its not, its a thoroughly Green 80%. There's a fingerprint.

Brilliant!!!

Remind me again what 80% of a big fat nothing is?

The Green fingerprints I'm referring to were the ones promised by Dan Boyle and Eamon Ryan before PfG II (and then forgotten after PfG II was voted on). Let me ask you;
1. Where is the Green levy on the banks?
2. Where is the Green proposal of fair risk sharing?
3. Where is the much hyped Green social dividend?

All promised before PfG ii ... all forgotten when PfG II was passed.

What would've been the advantage of crystalllising the loses on 28 September 2008?

Are you now arguing that the guarantee provided to Anglo Irish bank was a good thing?

What about the recap of the criminals in Anglo Irish Bank? OK, it has taken me a while to get back to you but, Alan Dukes a criminal???!!!

No, but Seanie might be.

Gormley and the entire Green PP voted confidence in Willy O'Dea when they knew he was guilty. Absolutely not so!

Gormley and the rest of the Green PP voted confidence in Willy O'Dea. However much you may dislike that and try to spin the truth, that is a fact.

[OceanFrog]

OK, reading back, I gotta admit I'm coming across, even to myself as a GP apologist.

No! Really??

I just thought you were a regular, run of the mill apologist for the perjurers and gombeens. But then I suppose a GP apologist is a lot, lot worse ...

And it's not that. It's just that I can't accept that the members of the GP parliamentary turned into baby-eating spawn of the antichrist, just because Bertie manoevered them into government.

Thats going a bit too far.

But the Greens have turned into gombeens to out gombeen even FF. Did you know that Gormley and Ryan have appointed over 1/3 of the Green Cllrs who lost seats last year to various quangos? None of these failed Green politicians were required to go through an interview process, and the argument could be made that none of them were qualified for the jobs they were appointed to. Elizabeth Davidson is a prime example ... a failed Green politician who was appointed to a €40,000 p.a. position on the Irish Film Classification Board despite having no qualification to do that job.

I could also talk about the way he Greens support cuts to education and health, and have voted for cuts to the dole and the wages of lower paid cleaners etc whilst supporting maintaining the salaries of 600+ higher paid civil servants, but I fear I'd be wasting my breath with you.

Many posters to p.ie have a reasonably clear fix on what their income source will most likely be in 3 years time: I'm guessing none of the GP parliamentarians, bar the Louth publican, have a clue in that regard, and for those of them short of pension age, with young families, I'm sure that is a real stress ...

Yes ... I feel sorry for the poor Green politicians and the "real stress" they are suffering!!! How will they survive on the generous state Ministerial and TD pensions for life? Which they will be able to collect immediately after the next GE if not elected.

How will they manage to survive!!!!!

I know ... lets start a collection for them!! We can start by asking the unemployed to contribute (especially the ones who suffered a cut in payments that the Green PP voted to support). We'll then move on to the lower paid civil servants (who also suffered a cut supported and voted for by the Green PP). We can then ask the parents of sick and disadvantaged children (who have suffered cuts to health and education, again voted for and supported by the Green PP).

I'm sure we can alleviate the "real stress" that John Gormley, Eamon Ryan, Dan Boyle, Paul Gogarty and co are suffering.

[Mitsui2]

I'm sure we can alleviate the "real stress" that John Gormley, Eamon Ryan, Dan Boyle, Paul Gogarty and co are suffering.

Well I can think of one way to alleviate the poor dears' stress. I suspect your mind is running in the same direction.