I was looking at the "Late Late Show," and they were discussing how much wealth we have because of the so-called Celtic Tiger. To me most people (except people in the public sector) have crap jobs that don't really pay that much. Nobody has a true sense of identity anymore. Sometimes I can see certain values of the class system. Now you get people coming from the underclass with a lot of money and not knowing how to behave and act in society. I think it is sometimes better for educated people to have the money. It's better to know your place and have a true sense of identity than have a load of money and not know who you are. Just speaking my thoughts out loud.

Originally Posted by dedalus

Now you get people coming from the underclass with a lot of money ...Nobody has a true sense of identity anymore

But the kids, or at the very least the grandkids, of those people will grown up with a stable sense of middle class identity. Unlike most countries, Ireland doesn't have an aristocracy, and thus the offspring of families going through upward social mobility are accepted unquestioned by members of their new "class", once they speak with the local accent.

The middle class are becoming very pronouned today, whoever they are. Maybe my grand children will be more discerning and point them out to me when I'm older.

These seem to be very authoritarian thoughts you are having. But to respond, it is better to have one generation of people become middle class wealthy and not know how to behave in society than to have never-ending generations of underclass indefinitely alienated from society.

Originally Posted by dedalus

Now you get people coming from the underclass with a lot of money and not knowing how to behave and act in society. I think it is sometimes better for educated people to have the money. It's better to know your place and have a true sense of identity than have a load of money and not know who you are. Just speaking my thoughts out loud.

"underclass" ? Is it not the fact the "educated" had "the money" in the first place that created this " underclass"? At least these lowersocioeconomic class members get to look after their kids needs and dont have to resort to or get drawn into crime, drugs etc

I smile with bemusement at the "Dublin 4" crowd - the seem to forget who they are. Best memory was my grandfather - who was of that old hard generation who let you know were he stood standing in the pub one night and a bunch of women came in. You know the type - loudmouthing about their holidays and their cars and stuff trying to outdo each other. One of them looked askance at grandda when he tried to get past them and tutted at him. So he turned around and asked who she was. she told him and he knew herf people. Then he said it - "sure I know ye now - yer grandda came over the hill in a donkey cart - sure weren't ye reared on potato skins eating the snotters of yersel"

I loved my Grandda

4 million people and 121 billion in mortgage debt, explain exactly how we are rich...

Originally Posted by Diatom

4 million people and 121 billion in mortgage debt,

speaks volumes about the reality versus delusion - as does this.

Originally Posted by dedalus

I was looking at the "Late Late Show," and they were discussing how much wealth we have because of the so-called Celtic Tiger. To me most people (except people in the public sector) have crap jobs that don't really pay that much. Nobody has a true sense of identity anymore. Sometimes I can see certain values of the class system. Now you get people coming from the underclass with a lot of money and not knowing how to behave and act in society. I think it is sometimes better for educated people to have the money. It's better to know your place and have a true sense of identity than have a load of money and not know who you are. Just speaking my thoughts out loud.

What's the story dedalus?

Are you getting worried that some of the "riff raff" are becoming wealthier than yourself and you are horrified (sorry bud! "mortified") that you might become a part of the underclass yourself very soon, particularly now that s************************y addresses all over this country are losing value at a rate of knots.

Do you realise that you are lamenting the social apartheid that existed in Ireland for years that caused the brightest of our people from the so called underclasses to emigrate because they couldn't get the decent jobs they deserved because they were taken up by people with the right connections. I loathe nepotism almost as much as the type of snobbery that jumped off the screen when reading your post.

I am proud to say I am from what you might consider the underclasses and I spent many years at 3rd level to gain an education so as to be able to show people like you up for the kn*b ends that you are when one has to work with you. I would hire someone from the underclasses any day over people that talk with marbles in their mouths because in my experience most of the supposed "upper" classes cohort that I have had the misfortune to have to train in my position couldn't organise a p*ss up in a brewery.

All this fretting about wealth, inequality and whether we have changed or not misses the more immediately important point that our prosperity is under threat to a greater degree than it has been for a long time, and that, consequently, we should be more focused on taking measures to boost competiveness and productivity. If a significant slowdon occurs, we will have more to worry about than we do now. And as bad as inequality may be, we have a much better chance of tackling it with a growing economy than with a more sluggish one.