Restaurant rip-off

[rockofcashel]

I'm using this for a rant, with an important question, especially if there is anyone who works in the Restaurant industry.

I was out for a meal last night, in a group of 6 people. The meal was crap, absolutely terrible, and badly overpriced. 30 euro for a chicken fillet covered in cold mozzarella cheese, with a cut up red onion, and roast potato pieces (straight from a packet)

But get this. Vegatables didn't come with the dinner. If you wanted buttered vegatables (diced carrot and a few runner beans), you had to buy them as a separate side order for €3.50.

The full meal came to €45 per head, with no wine, and with 3 people not having dessert or tea/coffee.

Total and utter rip off. The cost of materials for my dinner alone could not have cost €5.


Anyway, what really bugged me, was on the menu, there was a notice:

[size=7]10% service charge applies on groups of 8 or more. [/size]

Someone please explan to me why ?

Why why why ?

Why make a group of people pay 10 % more (on already overpriced food), for service ?

Thats the job of the restaurant... to serve people. whats the difference between serving two groups of 4, over 1 group of 8, so why charge one customer 10% more.


Why do Irish people accept it ?

That struck me because while we were there, there were also a group of French tourists having a meal. 14 of them. As their meal ended, the guy at the head of the table called the owner of the restaurant, and told them they were not paying the service charge, because they didn't know about it before they sat down to eat. She argued that it was stated on the menu, but he said that it hadn't been mentioned when the booked the table by phone, and therefore wasn't paying it.


He told her it was a ridiculous charge (loudly), and asked her to justify it. She stumbled and mumbled, oh there is more than eight people, but he told her straight up, so what ? If they were all separate, she'd still have to serve them, so why should the table have to spend €60-70 extra just for the pleasure of sitting together. She then admitted that "I suppose your right", and waived the service charge.

Fair dues to him.

But would 14 Irish people stand their ground ?

So someone please if they can....

What is the extra service charge for groups in restaurants for ?

[hiding behind a poster]

I agree with all of that, rock - Irish people seem to have had an instinctive deference, through the generations, to people like bank managers, priests, and believe it or not restaurateurs! Anytime I go into a restaurant that I've booked, if I see any mention of a mandatory service charge, I tell the waiting staff or the manager that we'll pay a service charge of our own choice if we think its warranted. And they always accept that - because if we leave, its too late for them to get another booking.

But the biggest problem in Ireland in this regard is that Irish people in restaurants have this terrible fear of looking either tight or picky. So they accept whatever crap appears in front of them, and never query prices, charges, etc, for fear of "making a scene". We need a few more Eddie Hobbses, in my view.

[yellowfish]

some friends and i had a simuler experiance, v bad food/ overpriced and no veg because we had not ordered it (we expected it with the food)
then to finish it off we were just ready to order pudding when we were asked to leave as he had a second booking for the table.
we very politely explained that we were only going to pay what we thought the meal was worth (about half the price) and then left, ignoring the managers rather histerical threats of the police. The only answer is to not be bullied and dont go back.
This was in England, i dont know that the irish are any less likely to complain.

[setanta]

Couldn't agree more with the sentiments of these posts.

One of the more disreputable tricks of the restaurant trade is to include a service charge on the bill and then invite you to include another 'tip' for the waiting staff when you pay. Even the portable credit card terminals have this option programmed into them.

The only answer and the one that I always, always give the restaurant is that (a) I will only pay a service charge if I believe that the service warrants it (which frankly is not very often in this country), and (b) I will only pay what I think the service is worth NOT what the restaurant thinks it is worth.

Stand up and complain - every time!

[JCSkinner]

Bear in mind that if you completely object to the charge levied by a restaurant, you are within your rights to refuse to pay until they agree a more reasonable price, and walk out the door, so long as you provide proof of your address for them to send a more legitimate bill to.
I did it a long time ago in Belfast, though I understand the same consumer rights apply in the Republic. The bill never came.

[rockofcashel]

But can anyone yet explain, what the hell is the service charge for ?

I mean think about it. When you go into a restaurant, it's part of the implicit contract between you and the restaurant that they actually deliver to your table, the goods that you pay for i.e. they serve you.

So why are you paying a charge on top of the price of the meal.

If you go into a shop and buy 20 cigarettes, and the girl behind the counter took your 6.40, but then asked you for 64 cent to hand them out to you from behind the counter, what would you say to her ?

I usually had no problems leaving a tip for waiting staff, but I seriously re-considering that now as well.

Or will the restaurant give me an option of going into the kitchen and getting my dinner myself after the chef has signalled that it has been cooked.

It's frankly ridiculous.

Where's TheBear, she's worked in the industry.

Tell us, what is a restaurants justification for a "service charge"

[JCSkinner]

They pay minimum wage and then expect the customer to bring the staff pay up to liveable levels. That's their 'justification' - morally blackmailing their customers.

[factual]

But can anyone yet explain, what the hell is the service charge for ?

I mean think about it. When you go into a restaurant, it's part of the implicit contract between you and the restaurant that they actually deliver to your table, the goods that you pay for i.e. they serve you.

So why are you paying a charge on top of the price of the meal.

If you go into a shop and buy 20 cigarettes, and the girl behind the counter took your 6.40, but then asked you for 64 cent to hand them out to you from behind the counter, what would you say to her ?

I usually had no problems leaving a tip for waiting staff, but I seriously re-considering that now as well.

Or will the restaurant give me an option of going into the kitchen and getting my dinner myself after the chef has signalled that it has been cooked.

It's frankly ridiculous.

Where's TheBear, she's worked in the industry.

Tell us, what is a restaurants justification for a "service charge"

You need to be a bit clearer I think. Which aspect of it is it that you find ridiculous:

1. the dis-aggregation into charge and service charge
2. the fact the amount is not fixed by the seller?
3. the fact the payment is not negotiated in advance but is decided on by the customer after the service quality is observed?

In the case of (1) this is not unusual as obviously in a lot of markets disaggregation goes on, e.g. when you buy an online good and the delivery charge also has to be paid.

In the case of (2) in many markets there is an element of bargaining, you don't have to pay the stated price but negotiate to an agreement.

In the case of (3) maybe that is what you are getting at? The service payment, or even food price, its something you *could* negotiate before entering the restaurant. But then you would not have seen the service so then the customer cannot have the option to pay less if she thinks the service was not great.

[Sidewinder]

The profit margin on food is astronomical. Here in Galway, two food-serving pubs that used to be about 50-50 drinkers and eaters have both gone out of their way over the last year to drive out the drinkers and become basically 2 large restaurants that happen to serve beer. Casual drinkers are most definitely no longer welcome, and in both cases almost all the locals have been driven out, after being told in no uncertain terms by management that their custom (2 or 3 nights a week for 10 years or more) was no longer desired. And most of the staff in both places are now Polish and Hungarian, and I'd be suprised if they are actually being paid minimum wage, they're probably on €3 an hour.

It's a massive racket. I can feed meself for the week for €10, but one plate of sub-standard food in yer average restaurant is supposed to be €20-30?

I'd only contemplate going out for a meal now in unusual circumstances (girlfriend's birthday, long lost cousins in town from America, stuff like that). Why volunteer to be mugged?

[farnaby]

But the biggest problem in Ireland in this regard is that Irish people in restaurants have this terrible fear of looking either tight or picky. So they accept whatever crap appears in front of them, and never query prices, charges, etc, for fear of "making a scene".

Agreed, we hate to complain face-to-face, perhaps a reason for the perception of our national easy-going character. It's not such a bad thing though - do we really want to be those insufferable people who openly complain about the slightest inconvenience, demanding perfect service every time and ruining their own nights in doing so? I think we are uncomfortable being served, and most comfortable when we don't feel a part of some strict 'customer-supplier relationship' - again, not really bad things.

If one part of the meal is bad, send it back straight away for something else and enjoy the rest of the meal. If the service stinks, put it down as a bad experience and don't go back.

Regarding the charges, we know eating out is expensive, and i've heard (anecdotal, newspaper article i can't source) restaurants still struggle despite their high prices (rent, insurance etc.). But yeah if the service is bad, no service charge should be paid.