Campaigning for Irish Diaspora Ancestral Return Rights: Jus Sanguin

[Alliance 109]

Considering Britains past and still minor present contempt towards Ireland, I couldn't care less frankly.

I lived there for 2 decades and for years endured Sectarian and Ethnic Prejudice, because I had been born in Ireland and sounded Irish. This was before and after the GFA.

Anyone whom whom emmigrated there and felt the full wrath of the "Paddy factor" would agree, I know that many have returned to Ireland being glad they left britain.

However, until the six counties are returned to us we have to engage with Britain especially since we are in the EU.

I do detect a chip on your shoulder. going by the nonsense you post around here i'm not surprised you got a hard time. i think you'd get that no matter where you went.

[Staropramen]

borders are not fixed. never have been. get over it.

and for the record this is the dumbest idea i seen yet. small weak insecure nations are usually the ones to come up with things like this.

Are Japan, Spain, and Italy small insecure nations?

[3rd3rd]

...all I seek is a reform in your citizenship law, which seems to divide families by allowing my unborn children to become citizens, and my father and mother to become citizens. but not me, and why? Because my parents registered after 1986.

JRM, are you sure of this interpretation? I've always assumed that the line was completely cut. That is, I thought, although my Dad can register with the Foreign Births Registry, that was the end of it, with respect to any future generations. For my and my sib's children's sake, I'd love to be wrong!

Of course, I'd really prefer a change/repeal.

And as a 50%er, stuff that 51% ********************e!

[Alliance 109]

Are Japan, Spain, and Italy small insecure nations?

small? prehaps not in size. but insecure for certain. Both Spain and Italy were once powerful nations (like Ireland was part of) who've now lost most if not all of their influence. They're nobodies. Spain especially. Japan has always been a peculiar place. France has a major chip on its shoulder, especially when it comes to the UK. Its completely envious of everything the UK has archived in its history (which France had and lost) and the influence it still has in the world.

Irelands independence movement has egg on its face. Independence achieved nothing. None of the promises of the utopia came true. home rule was rome rule. we didnt become the paris of the north, we didnt bolster our population to 50 million like pearse said. we went backwards. we didnt survive on our own. things like jus sanguin are a product of that failure.

[Thranduil]

It means nothing. One can be ethnically Irish, culturally Irish, have Irish nationality etc. But there is no such thing as Irish genes, and so there is no such thing as being "genetically Irish", and using the word "genetically" in this context means not actually knowing what the word means

I can generally detect Irishness when i look at someone, even if the others in the sample are British... Spotting an Eastern European is easy... an African? ... These differences arise because of genetics so how can you say that Irishness has no genetic component? Daft statement.

Bertie and Fianna Fail are New World Order, so is Fine Gael and (in all likelihood) Labour, PD's were very strongly NWO. NWO are anti-nationalistic, pro-multiculture (it's always nice to have the slaves at the bottom fighting each other for crumbs), they go abroad and consult before they make any major decision. An example of this attitude was expressed in a Gareth Fitzgerald article a few decades ago in which he denounced Irish nationalism in all it's forms and claimed that our identity would be just European. I tell you this... bringing many foreigners to Ireland is not incidental but by design, to destroy the concept of Irish separateness - think of it as being similiar to what the Brits were up to here for centuries but on wider scale. When you want to create a larger territory that is culturally homogenous out of many smaller pieces that are distinct you need to mix it up and destroy any concept of 'special claims' to a specific territory by a specific people. The UK of GB & I was created because of the success they had in eradicating Gaelic customs and later the Gaelic languages in Ireland and Scotland, as well as using plantations to speed it along AND the success they had in buying Irish nobles (generally speaking our nobility has for nearly 500 years looked to London and grovelled before them - some notable exceptions being the Ulster Gaels). In Australia they slaughtered aborigines for decades and then when they were marginalised, robbed their children to be raised in white homes, they still to this day send in troops to push them around every now and again, interfering in how they live - because their existence is a threat to the homogeneity of Australia and an unwelcome reminder of who the rightful owners of the place were. In terms of Ireland, the con was that we had a building bubble (called a 'boom', a 'Tiger') so this provided the justification to get them in, once in - it's mission accomplished, they aren't going out again... whatever happens. The bizarre thing is, they are still coming in despite our economic situation and Fianna Fail, FG etc aren't complaining either, why? Because it may not be right for Ireland but it is right on a broader scale, a NWO scale.

As for your comment about catholicism in the 60's. In the 60's the church ran this country, non catholics were discriminated against on a daily basis so they probably converted out of necessity rather than conviction.

Non-Catholics owned many of our papers, businesses and a disproportionate quantity of of our best land, in addition it was the Catholics... specifically the poor Catholic children and young women who were abducted, imprisoned, abused and forced to work as slaves... Speak not of discrimination against non-Catholics in the Irish Republic from the 20's to today, it was poor Catholics who had it the worst. I sometimes think the caretakers of our Republic worked hard to make certain the worst most oppressive elements of Catholicism blossomed in this country in order to keep the Catholic majority (especially the poor) in it's place. In fact, it was poor Irish Catholics who were oppressed in this country going right back for the better half of a millenium, continuously.

So boyos whats your reaction to the news that 54% feel immigration has been beneficial to the country?

It was probably taken in a constituency where 54% are immigrants (such as Dublin Central) - just kidding.

“Show me the man you honour, and I will know what kind of man you are.” - Thomas Carlyle

Interesting quote, did you know that Hitler spent his last days reading a biography of a German King by T Carlyle? Of course Carlyle himself was in favor of slavery inflicted on black people (the prevailing view among he and his pals was that they were inferior and as such suited to slavery) and at one stage considered whether a genocide against Irish people might not be for the best, so we know what kind of man HE was, but are YOU honouring HIM here?

[Horace Horse]

What is the strong link, exactly? You are over 3 generations (say 5, 6 or 7?) and you should have automatic right to Irish citizenship, even if you've never been here and think "The Quiet Man" was a documentary? If s/he feels so strongly, they can come here (despite your claims) and if they like it enough to hang around 5 years they can become citizens. If they don't, they can go back home.

Dotski is utterly wrong in his claim that an American, Australian, Argentinian etc. can come to Ireland and live for five years.

Dotski knows nothing of Irish immigration procedures & law.

Why do you insist on posting on matters you know nothing about, Dotski? Do you enjoy spreading your ignorance, knowing that people like me can't always be bothered to show you up?

[sparkey321]

You have clearly stated your prejudiced views toward the national language...... saying you have no interest in learning it. That is an insult to your own ancestors whom spoke Irish for generations against great adversity.

I have attacked you because you are very happy for the Irish Identity in all its splendour and richness, to be diluted and watered down until there is nothing left except a cheap tacky badge which is sold to the highest bidder in any tourist shop.

I remember a time when most of the passengers on Dublin Bus were local dubs talking about their social lives, including the visitor from the country coming upto dublin to see the city or visit friends and family.

Now because of people like you, the number of voices in shops and buses are not in english or irish but eastern europe and elsewhere....... many don't speak english and have no interest in doing so, I once asked a woman were the bank was and she couldn't even converse with me, yet she is working here in this country.

Irish people never wanted mass-immigration or Multi-culturalism which is why the Treaty of Nice was rejected in the first place and passed only when the promise of irish fears were falsely assured, but the promise was broken due to the stupidity and ignorance of gombeens that thought the more people that arrive the more tax and money we'll get.


Lastly most rural church going catholics and other practising catholics in towns/cities that followed the mahon tribunal believed that Bertie had something to hide and didn't buy his feeble claims in the case..... so claiming that those whom attend church side with a dubious character is nothing more than an insult.

You really are a twisted little sectarian *************************.

Read my post that you quoted again Muppet. I do not have contempt for the Irish language. I am indifferent towards it. I have contempt for the billions that were spent on a program to support the Irish language that has not worked. Billions spent translating documents into Irish. Documents that had to be dumped because no one requested them in Irish.

You spent 20 years in the UK, probably grew up there with a chip on your shoulder. All that time you developed an image on Ireland in your head, an image of Ireland that never existed. Then you came here to live and discovered that the reality didn't live up to your imagination. Then you have the cheek to tell us that we are less Irish than you because we dint live up to your vision of Ireland...... You love the Ireland of your imagination and have contempt for the Ireland that exists.

Well guess what *************************, I love Ireland warts and all, its my home, I grew up here, I paid my taxes here, I am part of my community, me and my family farmed the land. And that makes me more Irish than you.

And as for the language of my ancestors. My parents speak no Irish, of my four grandparents one of my grandmothers was a fluent speaker but not the Irish currently taught in schools, indeed the one time she tried to help me with Irish homework she gave up.

[DaBrow]

You really are a twisted little sectarian *************************.

Read my post that you quoted again Muppet. I do not have contempt for the Irish language. I am indifferent towards it. I have contempt for the billions that were spent on a program to support the Irish language that has not worked. Billions spent translating documents into Irish. Documents that had to be dumped because no one requested them in Irish.

You spent 20 years in the UK, probably grew up there with a chip on your shoulder. All that time you developed an image on Ireland in your head, an image of Ireland that never existed. Then you came here to live and discovered that the reality didn't live up to your imagination. Then you have the cheek to tell us that we are less Irish than you because we dint live up to your vision of Ireland...... You love the Ireland of your imagination and have contempt for the Ireland that exists.

Well guess what *************************, I love Ireland warts and all, its my home, I grew up here, I paid my taxes here, I am part of my community, me and my family farmed the land. And that makes me more Irish than you.

And as for the language of my ancestors. My parents speak no Irish, of my four grandparents one of my grandmothers was a fluent speaker but not the Irish currently taught in schools, indeed the one time she tried to help me with Irish homework she gave up.

Another accusation, where on this thread have I used derogatory language against Protestants? I am RC and have several relatives that are Protestant, not to mention friends that are non-catholic christians.

Feeling indifferent towards something usually means "Doesn't concern me and I don't care of its fate", apathy is a terrible trait to possess. I feel sorry for anyone whom is emotionally cold and detached from something so essential to defining the soul and character of a nation's culture aswell as its people.

I grew up as an Irishman despite being exiled from home, for all those years as I had no choice in where I lived. I visited several times a year, I read deep into Irish history because the UK blocks Ireland out of its history book and other colonies they ruled over, I longed for home because I appreciated everything that it symbolised and never took being Irish for granted.

Unlike some bitter and twisted people whom constantly ************************* and moan about how life in Ireland before The Celtic Typhoid AKA Celtic Tiger was crap, depressing and boring. The same people, whom were happy to allow hundred of thousands of non-nationals to arrive here, employ them as household slaves paying them way under the minimum wage and make them work for nearly 18 hours a day.

I as an Irish National have every right to give my voice in Irish affairs, as they affect me and my fellow countrymen whom are here in Ireland or abroad wanting to return home.

I demand we allow Diaspora children back here under a fairer Jus Sanguinis law like the Greeks have for their descendents, because there many thousands if not a hundred thousand Irish-Speakers that will ensure its survival and put people like you whom couldn't care less to shame..........

There is a section of Irish Society where Irish people whom hold their own language in contempt, need manners placed on them and be humbled by others who show their weak excuses towards irish is nothing more than ignorant prejudice and laziness.

[dotski_w_]

Dotski is utterly wrong in his claim that an American, Australian, Argentinian etc. can come to Ireland and live for five years.

Dotski knows nothing of Irish immigration procedures & law.

Why do you insist on posting on matters you know nothing about, Dotski? Do you enjoy spreading your ignorance, knowing that people like me can't always be bothered to show you up?

I know loads who have, but hey, what do you care, you're nothing but a pointless, racist troll.

BTW, you *do* know that your attempt to give bad rep fail, don't you? I presume it's because your rep is so low, but it fails every time.

[dotski_w_]

Dotski is utterly wrong in his claim that an American, Australian, Argentinian etc. can come to Ireland and live for five years.

Dotski knows nothing of Irish immigration procedures & law.

Why do you insist on posting on matters you know nothing about, Dotski? Do you enjoy spreading your ignorance, knowing that people like me can't always be bothered to show you up?

Moving to Ireland

Citizens of the United States will not need a visa to enter Ireland.

Staying

You will normally be given permission to remain for the duration of your stated purpose in the state up to a maximum of 12 months for any single period. This permission is renewable. People who have been issued work authorization/student permits will be granted residency for the duration of the work or study term.

The onus is on you to ensure that your Permission to Remain is not allowed to lapse. Once you have been legally resident in Ireland for five years, you may then apply to obtain a stamp giving permission to remain in the state for a further five years. During this period, there is no requirement to keep registering on an annual basis.

People who have been legally resident in Ireland for 10 years can then apply for a stamp giving them “residence without condition.” However, this entitles a person only to residency without going through all the red tape.

Citizenship

Irish citizenship is a valuable thing to have as it brings with it a whole range of economic and social benefits, including the right to live and work in any part of the European Union. And maybe one day your grandson may even play for the Irish soccer team—most of our heroes who wear the green jersey are in the team through the “Irish granny” rule. More prosaically, as an Irish citizen you'll have the right to vote (and be a candidate for elective office) in elections for both the European Parliament and at national level.

There are four ways to claim Irish citizenship:

* Citizenship through birth in Ireland
* Citizenship through descent
* Declaration of postnuptial citizenship
* Naturalization

Citizenship Through Naturalization
Ireland's Department of Justice handles applications for naturalization and citizenship is granted at the minister's “absolute discretion.” It's a slow process and generally takes between 18 and 24 months before any decision is reached. To be considered for Irish citizenship, the following criteria have to be satisfied: The applicant is resident in the state and is 18 years of age or older. During the preceding nine years, the applicant must have lived legally in the state for five of those years. The last of those five qualifying years must have been one of continuous residence, though an absence for vacations or business won't generally be regarded as a break in residence.

Applicants must satisfy the minister of their good character and also of their intention to live in Ireland after naturalization.

Should the minister grant your application, you'll be required to stand in open court before a district court judge and make a declaration of fidelity to the nation and loyalty to the state.