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  1. #21
    Accidental sock Accidental sock is offline
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    The internet?

    Is that thing still around?
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  2. #22
    kynikos kynikos is offline
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    Any examples from experience OP of becoming aware of and breaking out of that vague, distorted reflection of the reality?
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  3. #23
    Dearghoul Dearghoul is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by hollandia View Post
    In short people don't think. Of those that do think, a huge proportion come to the wrong conclusions. See p.ie for further details.
    Journal.ie's comments sections are more indicative of the problem at hand. Everyone hangs back until someone gets forthright then the agreements flow, then someone writes something contrary, if it's not a slow night, and opinion flows in the opposite direction.

    I think many of the contributors may be 'Young People'.

    That P.IE's determinadly hard core wrong headed, assess the evidence, and come to the most flapping loco conclusion is to be welcomed in a way.
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  4. #24
    roc_ roc_ is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by kynikos View Post
    Any examples from experience OP of becoming aware of and breaking out of that vague, distorted reflection of the reality?
    I would never suggest you can "break out of it".

    Our minds are limited, and reality is altogether too big, too complex, and too fleeting for direct acquaintance. We are not equipped to deal with so much subtlety, so much variety.

    Sure, we might directly immerse ourselves in it. We might study it, and if we are well educated there are scientific institutional devices to help try and steer us towards something resembling truth. Or at least a reflection of reality that is useful in some positive sense.

    Perhaps you might observe that a more conscious life is one in which you are conscious not only of what you see and learn, but of the prejudices which you bring to doing that. That is probably the most important thing.

    I note that at least with traditional media, for all its faults, there were institutional structures embedded, which did acknowledge the above, and in a certain sense handle it.


    PS These "institutional features" actually were needed for democracy to work (that's another post or probably a thread). I would say that's why today we have a crisis of democracy now in the internet age.
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  5. #25
    Carlos Danger Carlos Danger is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sheeple_Waker View Post
    Tbh think this is a lot more pronounced in the States than Ireland. One of the more insidious trends of the past decade or so has been the willingness of public broadcasters to defame those from the other side in partisan attacks. Referring to people who disagree with your politics as 'libtards' or the like is poisonous to democracy.
    Would you say referring to people who don't share your views as 'sheeple' or the like is poisonous to democracy?

    Glasshouses, a mhac.
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  6. #26
    Carlos Danger Carlos Danger is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by publicrealm View Post
    Good OP.

    I wasn't aware of the popularity of these kiddie videos and I appreciate the concern about their content - but I agree with the point that we are all (not just the toddlers) being exposed to an unprecedented deluge of 'information' of dubious value, some of it quite deliberately targeted by vested interests.

    Whoever controls the online message is now in a position to sway (or reinforce) the opinion of the masses - it would be foolish to think that this is not the focus of power-brokers worldwide.

    I don't know how to address this however, as stupid people like to have their views reinforced - particularly racists imo - and P.ie is living proof of how the cancer grows and kills its host.
    This segment from a recent 60 Minutes is fascinating.

    https://www.cbsnews.com/videos/secret-weapon/
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  7. #27
    roc_ roc_ is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carlos Danger View Post
    Would you say referring to people who don't share your views as 'sheeple' or the like is poisonous to democracy?

    Glasshouses, a mhac.
    Indeed.

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  8. #28
    Ratio Et Fides Ratio Et Fides is offline

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    A thing that I have noticed increasing that is extremely worrying is that more and more people are falling into black and white thinking rather than trying to understand the complexities of situations.

    For instance a lot of people here seem to believe that either you support Zionist colonialism full on, see Palestinians as subhuman and believe that Jews can do no wrong or you are a raging anti-Semite. Similarly you have people who believe that either you believer one hundred and ten per cent in everything that the PIRA did or you see them as having been a blood thirsty pack of psychopaths. This kind of black and white seems to be particularly strong in those who would regard themselves as "Liberal".
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  9. #29
    farnaby farnaby is offline
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    At the centre of many forms of religion and spirituality is the notion that salvation comes from union - identification with a single being/consciousness etc. The opposite - suffering - comes from focus on our individual self and its poisonous desires, wants, conflicts and jealousies.

    And as that article shows, now we've moved from material objects of desire to virtual objects of obsession - which are constantly multiplying and spreading at almost zero cost to put us in a constant state of anger, fear, resentment, jealousy etc.

    No wonder the kids are unhappy and obese...
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  10. #30
    roc_ roc_ is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratio Et Fides View Post
    For instance a lot of people here seem to believe that either you support Zionist colonialism full on, see Palestinians as subhuman and believe that Jews can do no wrong or you are a raging anti-Semite...
    There is no one on earth who thinks that way, or even close to it.

    Such a statement is a product entirely of your own mind and making.

    Now while your statement is certainly on the very extreme end of the spectrum, however, I do think you are well illustrating a certain tendency here.

    Vis. The willful mischaracterisation of those with different views is a problem getting markedly worse with internet use.


    (PS Speaking for myself, I have only ever cast the accusation of antisemitism at the most overt, obsessive demonisation of Israel and the Israelis - where a poster continuously, persistently, obsessively, falsely accuses Israeli Jews of "profiteering", "war-mongering", "cowardice", "scheming", "malevolence", "immorality", "child-murdering", and who promotes twisted revisionism of Zionism, of "massacres", "expulsions", "ethnic-cleansing", "mass-murder", "land-stealing", "victim-hood", comparing them to Nazis, and so on and so forth. Criticizing Israel is not antisemitism. Absolutely not. Frantically besmirching them at every opportunity towards depriving them of their rights, even the right to existence, regularly reveals itself as antisemitism, yes.).
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