'black people are less intelligent than white people'.....

[Justin]

This debate raises the whole issue of science and society. Is science only accepted when it suits society's values? I'm not for a minute saying he's right, but in a more racist future he would be seen as preaching truth in the wilderness. Much as peole who claimed racism was a meaningless term were ignored through much of the glory days of scientific racism. Which, lets not forget, was only a few decades ago.
Genetic studies have always been dancing along the edge of political correctness, with designer babies and quests for the gay gene.

Science and society are always integral,how could it be otherwise...

[QuizMaster]

Do not confuse his scientific expertise (one very specific branch of biochemistry) with his expertise on the relative intelligence of populations, which is ffucck all.
He is speaking here as an ordinary Joe Public, and not a very nice one at that. Sure one time he said all women should be genetically engineered to be pretty.

[905]

This debate raises the whole issue of science and society. Is science only accepted when it suits society's values? I'm not for a minute saying he's right, but in a more racist future he would be seen as preaching truth in the wilderness. Much as peole who claimed racism was a meaningless term were ignored through much of the glory days of scientific racism. Which, lets not forget, was only a few decades ago.
Genetic studies have always been dancing along the edge of political correctness, with designer babies and quests for the gay gene.

Science and society are always integral,how could it be otherwise...

Except when they're not. This man is claiming that there is reason to believe that racism is a scientifically valid concept. From what I can gather from the above threads he has raised troubling questions about homosexuality and women scientists (bearing in mind he worked with one). These are not views which are acceptable in today's society.

[Justin]

This debate raises the whole issue of science and society. Is science only accepted when it suits society's values? I'm not for a minute saying he's right, but in a more racist future he would be seen as preaching truth in the wilderness. Much as peole who claimed racism was a meaningless term were ignored through much of the glory days of scientific racism. Which, lets not forget, was only a few decades ago.
Genetic studies have always been dancing along the edge of political correctness, with designer babies and quests for the gay gene.

Science and society are always integral,how could it be otherwise...

Except when they're not. This man is claiming that there is reason to believe that racism is a scientifically valid concept. From what I can gather from the above threads he has raised troubling questions about homosexuality and women scientists (bearing in mind he worked with one). These are not views which are acceptable in today's society.

Yes he's 'claiming' it at a time when there's a political view that Africa is a basket case and there's nowt 'we' can do about it.

[905]

Hmm, I see your point but I still think most people put the African crisis down to corruption, neo-colonialism and bad managment, which are social ills and not neccessarily biological.

[Defeated Romanticist]

My comment on this issue is a big fat so what?

There are smart black people, there are smart white people,
There are stupid black people, there are stupid white people,

Why should someone be regarded as different because others with the same skin colour are thick/smart?

Racism like most of the other ills in our society is derived from an attempt to group people irregardless of their individuality. When we start to address people as individuals with the respect that entails, the percieved abuses that certain individuals suffer will dissapate but not until.

Attempts at both irradicating differences and accentuating them between groups of people are, have always been, and always will be, rationalised racism.

[jmcc]

Or perhaps, far more terrifying for those politically correct types, people are not all equal. And of course this is a book tour and the more controversial a topic, the more books will be sold.

Regards...jmcc

[alonso]

If we took US voting patterns as a sample, I reckon his thesis may be easily rubbished

[905]

I comment on this issue is a big fat so what?

There are smart black people, there are smart white people,
There are stupid black people, there are stupid white people,

Why should someone be regarded as different because others with the same skin colour are thick/smart?

Racism like most of the other ills in our society is derived from an attempt to group people irregardless of their individuality. When we start to address people as individuals with the respect that entails, the percieved abuses that certain individuals suffer will dissapate but not until.

Attempts at both irradicating differences and accentuating them between groups of people are, have always been, and always will be, rationalised racism.

This will get me in a lot of trouble but here goes.
Group identity is one thing most authorities, at the moment, ascribe to genetics. The practical benefits are obvious. People have created identities out of almost anything: religion, skin colour, ethnicity, favourite soccor club, parish boundaries, their own names (see these strange get-togethers of people with Jones for a surname etc.). Individuals are simply not on the genetic cards, they're the people living in caves on the outskirts of society and not contributing genetically.
I don't know what you mean by rationalised racism, racism is the belief that people cab be grouped according to their physical (ie. gentic) structure. Other group identities are created around all sorts of things. That's not saying they're not as destructive.

[Defeated Romanticist]

I comment on this issue is a big fat so what?

There are smart black people, there are smart white people,
There are stupid black people, there are stupid white people,

Why should someone be regarded as different because others with the same skin colour are thick/smart?

Racism like most of the other ills in our society is derived from an attempt to group people irregardless of their individuality. When we start to address people as individuals with the respect that entails, the percieved abuses that certain individuals suffer will dissapate but not until.

Attempts at both irradicating differences and accentuating them between groups of people are, have always been, and always will be, rationalised racism.

This will get me in a lot of trouble but here goes.
Group identity is one thing most authorities, at the moment, ascribe to genetics. The practical benefits are obvious. People have created identities out of almost anything: religion, skin colour, ethnicity, favourite soccor club, parish boundaries, their own names (see these strange get-togethers of people with Jones for a surname etc.). Individuals are simply not on the genetic cards, they're the people living in caves on the outskirts of society and not contributing genetically.
I don't know what you mean by rationalised racism, racism is the belief that people cab be grouped according to their physical (ie. gentic) structure. Other group identities are created around all sorts of things. That's not saying they're not as destructive.

Have you ever considered that it is the group identity that is the problem, is the reason for wars and genocides and not the solution. Nietzsche wrote of the death of God. Substitute Society for God and you will liberate the individual. There is no Society and the sooner we realise and accept that the better. People in the west liberated themselves from the crutch of religon now the should liberate their minds from the crutch of the many, the society, the group. It isn't easy to be a self-identified individual but if you value Truth you must accept the truth.