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  1. #111
    Happytolearn Happytolearn is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by pippakin View Post
    Please explain how "Oh dear" is defensive. I'm totally anti Muslim I think all women should be and I can't understand any woman who joins or worse allows her daughter to join such an abusive, aggressive cult.
    'Oh dear' didn't explain your view - but this post engaged with me. There are elements of islam I completely reject - we will agree on much of that - but the idea of deporting those we don't agree with is, in my view, going down a dangerous path. I believe muslim immigration to Europe will be the one thing that could modernise the religon - making it compatible with our way of life. I see this in the countless thousands of second generation muslims who have integrated to a British way of life.
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  2. #112
    WilliamLee WilliamLee is offline
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    You just have to look at how America under Obama has become so neutered and politically correct that they cant even bring themselves to mention the role of radical Islam on the Boston Bombing. Obama and Biden refuse to even mention Islam in any of their pitiful waffles on the subject. With the largest Mosque in Europe planned for Ireland and some radicals already living here this is a discussion that needs to take place. I could cop out and say that I am not tarring all Muslims with the same brush (just the radical element) but until moderate Muslims start to make real noises they must take a fair portion of blame for what these terrorists do.
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  3. #113
    pippakin pippakin is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Happytolearn View Post
    'Oh dear' didn't explain your view - but this post engaged with me. There are elements of islam I completely reject - we will agree on much of that - but the idea of deporting those we don't agree with is, in my view, going down a dangerous path. I believe muslim immigration to Europe will be the one thing that could modernise the religon - making it compatible with our way of life. I see this in the countless thousands of second generation muslims who have integrated to a British way of life.


    You mean those Muslims who never say a word against the fundamentalists, the ones who allow/encourage extremist Imams into their mosques, those ones?
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  4. #114
    Zerubbabel Zerubbabel is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by pippakin View Post
    [/B]

    You mean those Muslims who never say a word against the fundamentalists, the ones who allow/encourage extremist Imams into their mosques, those ones?
    You mean the ones that speak out against terrorism and ban those inciting terrorism from their mosques ?
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  5. #115
    Bonsai Experiment Bonsai Experiment is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by pippakin View Post
    The debate is late but it must be had and those who promote Islam should be deported to the Islamic country of their choice after all its all Islam.
    So you're in favour of doing away with muslims and Human Rights, why dont your start a medieval cult and roll back time ?
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  6. #116
    Happytolearn Happytolearn is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by pippakin View Post
    [/B]

    You mean those Muslims who never say a word against the fundamentalists, the ones who allow/encourage extremist Imams into their mosques, those ones?
    There's a few different ways of looking at this issue - each can be backed up with links till the cows come home. Yes - our culture could be subsumed to the point that our grandchildren will be living under sharia - but I have a little more faith in the advancements we've made and the freedoms we've fought for. Every culture conjures up the bogeyman that will lead to its ultimate destruction - it's perfectly normal. I don't buy into this one - my proof isn't linkable - it's my impression of 7 years living in the UK.
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  7. #117
    WilliamLee WilliamLee is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zerubbabel View Post
    You mean the ones that speak out against terrorism and ban those inciting terrorism from their mosques ?
    I haven't heard any. I'd say very few people (if any) could honestly say they have seen or heard any moderate Muslim speaking out against Islamist terrorists. If there are any they are a tiny minority. Banning them from Mosques is effectively keeping it within Islam - it is not good enough.

    In America this guy is the best the Muslim community can come up with...never mind that it's O'Reilly doing the interview, this guy manages to stick his head in the noose pretty well.

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  8. #118
    Bonsai Experiment Bonsai Experiment is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by WilliamLee View Post
    I could cop out and say that I am not tarring all Muslims with the same brush (just the radical element) but until moderate Muslims start to make real noises they must take a fair portion of blame for what these terrorists do.
    Are you going to take responsibility for White Supremacists ? (I'm presuming you are white here)
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  9. #119
    IvoShandor IvoShandor is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Doyle View Post
    All.
    No. I have never heard of any badness coming from Bahais or Quakers.

    Quote Originally Posted by pippakin View Post
    There have almost certainly always been Muslims in western countries even including here. What has been aggressively different starting from the sixties is multiculturalism. The indigenous population of the western countries have been told that any objection is racist and sectarian meanwhile the Muslim and some other smaller religions indifferent to such attacks and anyway the beneficiary of them carried on preaching their often medieval faith regardless.

    The result is an entire generation have grown up relatively well off with a western education and an irrational hatred of the country they live in.
    To a degree,yes. The appearance of "Multiculturalism" as an ideology had bad consequences and all this coincided with the Iranian revolution and the Saudis flexing their monetary muscles and extending their influence. Proponents of a strand of left/liberal thought were so enamoured of the multi-cultural ideal-even integration was frowned upon,never mind assimilation- that they were oblivious to the fact that it was leading to seperatism and ghettoization,and their emphasis on cultural and community rights (while neglecting duties and responsibilities) began to encourage a culture of complaint and a phobia of making offence which compounded the problem and encouraged radicals. Some of these people were frankly, cloud-cuckoolanders wasting time fussing about statues of pigs and suchlike. When the first disturbances about 'The Satanic Verses' manifested all those years ago,they should have been stamped on-hard,but unfortunately a line wasn't drawn soon enough.
    Last edited by IvoShandor; 28th April 2013 at 07:20 PM.
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  10. #120
    WilliamLee WilliamLee is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonsai Experiment View Post
    Are you going to take responsibility for White Supremacists ? (I'm presuming you are white here)
    White supremacists (I'm assuming youre talking about hillbilly types) do not pose a worldwide threat, nor do they carry out acts of mass destruction on civilian targets, nor are they they inspiration for regimes intent on wiping other countries off the map with nuclear weapons. You are not even remotely comparing like with like. Secondly being white is not akin to a radical version of religion that one can disassociate oneself from. Pick a better one....

    Incidentally there is no shortage of "white people" taking these loons to task. If they ever did become a force of any kind I have no doubt that they would be beaten down without much hesitation. Dont forget we had our own terrorists here (a much better comparison) and most of us made a pretty good job of rejecting their evil.
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