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  1. #351
    diaspora-mick diaspora-mick is offline
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    [QUOTE=Des Quirell;5826452 I make it a rule to never provide anyone with any information more then their strict requirements demand. I would certainly never give a state organisation any information regarding my beliefs or lack of them. There is simply no need for them to know that.[/QUOTE]

    Well just make sure that you always pay cash then ...
    Payment firms slammed for collecting EC card customer data

    The state is not the only player in the data collection game ...
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  2. #352
    jo9jo jo9jo is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by diaspora-mick View Post
    Well just make sure that you always pay cash then ...
    Payment firms slammed for collecting EC card customer data

    The state is not the only player in the data collection game ...
    How does the SCHUFA determine creditworthiness ?
    Is it not a condition of use of a financial product that your credit worthiness is recorded and reported ?

    Can anyone clarify the points ?
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  3. #353
    Des Quirell Des Quirell is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by diaspora-mick View Post
    Well just make sure that you always pay cash then ...
    Payment firms slammed for collecting EC card customer data

    The state is not the only player in the data collection game ...
    I'm in the business of data security and data protection.

    It's my livelihood.

    I have around 30 variants on my name and address - all are well within the constraints demanded of the French and Irish postal systems. When my details are sold to any other agency I can always prove who sold them.

    I made a tidy sum from AIB in the mid-80's by being able to prove that someone in their organisation had passed my details on to a third party.

    I made another tidy sum in the 90's as well. And Another one from NIB in the noughties.

    I'm not a tinfoil hat merchant; I merely expect and demand that my rights are respected by any institution which contains data on me. All of this is contained in Data Protection legislation.

    To protect myself I introduce subtle changes to my name and address when I register for services.

    It's easy in Ireland. One's name can be in Irish and the address in English. Or vice versa. In the address one can include towlland on the same line as house name, or vice versa. There's lots of variations possible.

    Then ,when the time-sharing pitches arrive you can identify the source for their address.

    It's more difficult in France. Addresses have much more formal structure.

    But it's still possible.
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  4. #354
    diaspora-mick diaspora-mick is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by jo9jo View Post
    How does the SCHUFA determine creditworthiness ?
    Is it not a condition of use of a financial product that your credit worthiness is recorded and reported ?

    Can anyone clarify the points ?
    By using Facebook ?
    German Credit Agency Plans to Analyze Individual Facebook Pages - SPIEGEL ONLINE

    Seriously though, I think that they record information about unpaid bills and loan defaults.
    How they actually get this info I'm not sure.
    It may be that the banks report loan defaults.
    Some things like registered court judgements would be publicly available.
    SCHUFA
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  5. #355
    Des Quirell Des Quirell is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by diaspora-mick View Post
    Well just make sure that you always pay cash then ...
    Payment firms slammed for collecting EC card customer data

    The state is not the only player in the data collection game ...
    BTW, the fact that others do it is not a justification of the practice. In the examples I've personally encountered it was always private bodies. Just thought you should know that.
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  6. #356
    diaspora-mick diaspora-mick is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Des Quirell View Post
    BTW, the fact that others do it is not a justification of the practice. In the examples I've personally encountered it was always private bodies. Just thought you should know that.
    I certainly wasn't trying to justify the practice. More like pointing out that the threat doesn't only come from the state sector.
    But you seem to be keenly aware of the issues ... even managing to outsmart the malefactors ...
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  7. #357
    Des Quirell Des Quirell is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by diaspora-mick View Post
    I certainly wasn't trying to justify the practice. More like pointing out that the threat doesn't only come from the state sector.
    But you seem to be keenly aware of the issues ... even managing to outsmart the malefactors ...
    I've made some good money through including or omitting a comma in an address!

    I'd seriously recommend the practice to everybody here. Put a fingerprint on your address when registering with major bodies.

    The first time that I became aware that my data had been shared was in '86, when I got a very aggressive pitch from a timshare company based in Kilkenny promising me a videocamera if I went down and committed to a day of sales pitches for timeshares in Spain.

    Once-in-a-lifetime opportunities. Yup. You'd only be able to afford one once in a lifetime.

    The thing was that the address was slightly misspelt and the only bill or statement which has that misspelling was the one from my bank.

    When I brought the letter into my bank (along with sundry tax statements and other bills) my manager (one of the old school) was horrified and rang bank HQ in my presence. They immediately wrote off my overdraft and under his prompting offered a compensation payment.

    That was an accident, but I decided to protect myself from that day on.
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  8. #358
    Thac0man Thac0man is offline
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    A court ruling in Germany over this, and it falls in favour of the tax. The following item from Euronews presents the ruling and its context very well:

    German court tells Catholics to serve both God and money | euronews, world news

    The starkly contrasting views for and against are well expressed.

    Magnus Lux, a member of the We Are The Church association which represents Catholics who oppose the tax, said the decision was legally wrong.
    “Six years ago, the German Council for Legal Interpretation stated clearly that exiting the public institution does not mean one has renounced one’s beliefs. That difference is very important,” he said.
    Magnus Lux (and congratulations to him for having such a cool sounding name) makes a solid point based on principle. But as the reports says, Jewish and Protestent churches already operate such a tax on its believers. So legal precident in Germany seemed on the side of the RC already.

    But even if there was not a tax (and I think there will not be in Ireland), some way would be found to establish a mechanism for maintaining solidarity and defining who is keeping close to it. And that could translate over here in some form. The RC may peddle supernatural powers, but it cannot use them to devine who is doing enough to keep in themselves in the flock. That takes paper work. But I still see it as being a hard thing actually cutting people off, some sort of reasonible compromise seems likely. Otherwise its odd to think of people needing a receipt to get communion.
    Last edited by Thac0man; 1st October 2012 at 09:32 AM.
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