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  1. #591
    Toland Toland is offline
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    I think that a valid point was almost raised by this thread. It's a pity the effect was ruined by a chauvinistic thread title that is uninformative to the any messageboard browser except to the extent that it might be seen as reflecting the real motivation of the OP.
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  2. #592
    Equinox Equinox is online now

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    Quote Originally Posted by statsman View Post
    Fortunately, public policy is not built upon the shaky ground of your imagination.
    Or the democratic will of the people sadly. I'm reminded if the howls from the left at the overwhelming passing of the citizenship refferendum, when for once the policy and public opinion aligned. Naturally everything possible has been done to undermine that since.
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  3. #593
    Toland Toland is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Parlon View Post
    You've walked into the trap of using the social values of Riyadh as a comparison for what we should do in Ireland. That doesn't work, when you follow it through. I don't like people wearing burkas; I worry about what it signifies, however, I would hesitiate before I said "ban them". The people who are here, are here. We just need to pay attention to how our society evolves and I would say the presence of burkas indicates our society is starting to evolve in a manner most Irish people are not happy with. That's the issue.
    I like your post, but I disagree on hesitating to ban burkas. I think clothing that makes it impossible to identify a person should be banned, especially any sort of clothing carrying the symbolism of the Niqab.
    Last edited by Toland; 6th July 2012 at 09:53 AM.
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  4. #594
    NewDawn1 NewDawn1 is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by statsman View Post


    Especially pig dogs.

    That is literally a perfect idea!
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  5. #595
    Equinox Equinox is online now

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Parlon View Post
    You've walked into the trap of using the social values of Riyadh as a comparison for what we should do in Ireland. That doesn't work, when you follow it through. I don't like people wearing burkas; I worry about what it signifies, however, I would hesitiate before I said "ban them". The people who are here, are here. We just need to pay attention to how our society evolves and I would say the presence of burkas indicates our society is starting to evolve in a manner most Irish people are not happy with. That's the issue.
    It works perfectly well with me. The Saudi's can do what they like, I can still find it objectionable and express my objection to it, but the good fight is there to be fought by Saudi women (and many are defying Neanderthal attitudes like the driving ban etc.) and Saudi liberals.
    They are the people that can change Saudi society, not me or my objection.
    The only equivalence I am drawing is the right of a society to determine what it deems culturally acceptable. The Saudi's are entitled to condemn Ireland as a modern day Sodom and Gomorrah if they wish, but if they want to come and live in Sodom, well they can just shut up and lube the hell up....
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  6. #596
    Monday Monday Monday Monday is offline
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    I don't like women wearing the Burkha either but I just want to live in a society with a high degree of personal freedom. If that leaves people free to regard themselves as second-class citizens and dress weirdly, then so be it. It is acceptable to me.

    The real problem IMO is that we allow religious orders to control our education system.

    Muslims who live in Ireland should have their children in a state-run secular education system. Or they can leave. If an Asian woman is properly educated, and still chooses to wear ridiculous religious clothing, then fair enough. Unfortunately my solution wouldn't be acceptable to a lot of Right minded Christians.
    Last edited by Monday Monday; 6th July 2012 at 09:32 AM.
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  7. #597
    statsman statsman is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equinox View Post
    Or the democratic will of the people sadly. I'm reminded if the howls from the left at the overwhelming passing of the citizenship refferendum, when for once the policy and public opinion aligned. Naturally everything possible has been done to undermine that since.
    I'm perfectly happy to live with the constitutional rules on citizenship:

    1° On the coming into operation of this Constitution any person who was a citizen of Saorstát Éireann immediately before the coming into operation of this Constitution shall become and be a citizen of Ireland.

    2° The future acquisition and loss of Irish nationality and citizenship shall be determined in accordance with law.
    3° No person may be excluded from Irish nationality and citizenship by reason of the sex of such person.

    2 1° Notwithstanding any other provision of this Constitution, a person born in the island of Ireland, which includes its islands and seas, who does not have, at the time of the birth of that person, at least one parent who is an Irish citizen
    or entitled to be an Irish citizen is not entitled to Irish citizenship or nationality, unless provided for by law.

    2° This section shall not apply to persons born before the date of the enactment of this section,

    3 Fidelity to the nation and loyalty to the State are fundamental political duties of all citizens.
    Oddly enough, I see no reference to some kind of national costume that must be worn by all true citizens. Actually, I suspect that the constitutional position is that Irish citizens are legally and constitutionally entitled to wear pretty much what they want out in the streets, apart from paramilitary uniforms, a Garda uniform if not a member of the force, or nothing at all.
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  8. #598
    NewDawn1 NewDawn1 is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mitsui2 View Post
    I think by this stage everyone knows you believe that, Screed. What most don't seem able to understand, beyond the self-admitted fact that you find them a bit scary, is why you believe it.
    Several hold ups of banks in Luton by women wearing those symbols of oppression and some people in England still think like you. Safety clearly is not a priority of yours. I am guessing you will be one of the last people in Ireland to change their minds when we choose wisely like the French have already done.
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  9. #599
    DigitalShariah DigitalShariah is offline
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    Should we ban sunglasses? What about wigs? Facial hair also obscures the face - should we ban that too?
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  10. #600
    statsman statsman is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by DigitalShariah View Post
    Should we ban sunglasses? What about wigs? Facial hair also obscures the face - should we ban that too?
    Ban hairy sunglasses; that'll fix everything that's wrong with this country of ours.
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