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  1. #581
    Monday Monday Monday Monday is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twin Towers View Post
    If it's not acceptable in France, why should it be acceptable here?
    I don't know.

    But at least you are being honest by stating your opinions as your opinions rather than as facts.
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  2. #582
    Equinox Equinox is online now

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monday Monday View Post
    I think the point your are missing Equinox is that it is acceptable to stroll down O'Connell street in a Burka.
    You don't want it to be, but it is.

    Just as it is acceptable for a Punk Rocker to stroll down O'Connell street with a t-shirt showing an aborted foetus impaled on a coat hanger.

    Distasteful? Yes. Acceptable? Yes.
    I don't think that I'm missing the point at all. The French have decided that it IS unacceptable to walk down the Champs Elysee wearing a Burkha, I’d imagine that the majority of Irish people would consider the Burkha or niqab culturally unacceptable also, we’re just too gutless to challenge it and stand up for our own cultural values in the manner that the French have (nothing new there of course).
    As for your attempt to draw an equivalence between a punk expressing an obnoxious attitude and a woman conditioned to think of herself as a second class citizen that must remain covered and unapproachable, it’s not the same thing at all (nice relativist dodge though but I won’t be pin dancing for you). Hell, she might be wearing the same T-shirt, we’d never know though because that kind of self expression is not permitted to her, and THAT is the point.
    Last edited by Equinox; 6th July 2012 at 09:12 AM.
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  3. #583
    Monday Monday Monday Monday is offline
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    So, things are "unacceptable" but we are too gutless to do anything about it.

    You realise that is an oxymoron.
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  4. #584
    Clanrickard Clanrickard is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equinox View Post
    ence between a punk expressing an obnoxious attitude and a woman conditioned to think of herself as a second class citizen that must remain covered and unapproachable, it’s not the same thing at all (nice relativist dodge though but I won’t be pin dancing for you). Hell, she might be wearing the same T-shirt, we’d never know though because that kind of self expression is not permitted to her, and THAT is the point.
    Excellent post.
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  5. #585
    Clanrickard Clanrickard is online now
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monday Monday View Post
    So, things are "unacceptable" but we are too gutless to do anything about it.

    You realise that is an oxymoron.
    The "we" was directed at our politicians rather than the people themselves.
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  6. #586
    statsman statsman is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equinox View Post
    I don't think that I'm missing the point at all. The French have decided that it IS unacceptable to walk down the Champs Elysee wearing a Burkha, I’d imagine that the majority of Irish people would consider the Burkha or niqab culturally unacceptable also, we’re just too gutless to challenge it and stand up for our own cultural values in the manner that the French have (nothing new there of course).
    As for your attempt to draw an equivalence between a punk expressing an obnoxious attitude and a woman conditioned to think of herself as a second class citizen that must remain covered and unapproachable, it’s not the same thing at all (nice relativist dodge though but I won’t be pin dancing for you). Hell, she might be wearing the same T-shirt, we’d never know though because that kind of self expression is not permitted to her, and THAT is the point.
    Fortunately, public policy is not built upon the shaky ground of your imagination.
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  7. #587
    Kevin Parlon Kevin Parlon is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equinox View Post
    If it’s not acceptable to stroll down the main streets of Riyadh in a Bikini, then it should be equally offensive to stroll down O’ Connell St in a Burkha.
    You've walked into the trap of using the social values of Riyadh as a comparison for what we should do in Ireland. That doesn't work, when you follow it through. I don't like people wearing burkas; I worry about what it signifies, however, I would hesitiate before I said "ban them". The people who are here, are here. We just need to pay attention to how our society evolves and I would say the presence of burkas indicates our society is starting to evolve in a manner most Irish people are not happy with. That's the issue.
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  8. #588
    Toland Toland is offline
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    I think that a valid point was almost raised by this thread. It's a pity the effect was ruined by a chauvinistic thread title that is uninformative to the any messageboard browser except to the extent that it might be seen as reflecting the real motivation of the OP.
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  9. #589
    Equinox Equinox is online now

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    Quote Originally Posted by statsman View Post
    Fortunately, public policy is not built upon the shaky ground of your imagination.
    Or the democratic will of the people sadly. I'm reminded if the howls from the left at the overwhelming passing of the citizenship refferendum, when for once the policy and public opinion aligned. Naturally everything possible has been done to undermine that since.
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  10. #590
    Toland Toland is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Parlon View Post
    You've walked into the trap of using the social values of Riyadh as a comparison for what we should do in Ireland. That doesn't work, when you follow it through. I don't like people wearing burkas; I worry about what it signifies, however, I would hesitiate before I said "ban them". The people who are here, are here. We just need to pay attention to how our society evolves and I would say the presence of burkas indicates our society is starting to evolve in a manner most Irish people are not happy with. That's the issue.
    I like your post, but I disagree on hesitating to ban burkas. I think clothing that makes it impossible to identify a person should be banned, especially any sort of clothing carrying the symbolism of the Niqab.
    Last edited by Toland; 6th July 2012 at 09:53 AM.
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