The Irish catholic tradition has historically always been obedient in the final analysis to the authority of Rome.Originally Posted by Ren84
Talk of an original independent celtic church has no historical support.
Were a large swathe of the catholic Irish hierarchy to set up their own organisation independent of Rome that indeed would be a schism.
There is no evidence of any such movement at the present time TMK.
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"The medium is the message"
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All religions are shyte!
People are taking their own lives in hand and getting on with it. The more they learn about these sky fairys the more they distance themselves from that fallacy!
There is no soul there is no god!
No invitations here.
That you get agitated and abusive concerning the reality/unreality of hell may be an indication
that you are slightly fearful and uncertain.
Can you be absolutely certain there is , as you say, "no such thing as hell" ?
You are already deeply confused on the issue of loyalty to the Roman pontiff which is the lodestone of all true catholic churches and your assertions concerning some mythical independent Irish catholic celtic church are becoming increasingly risible.
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You should look at December 4th's "Would You Believe" on RTE player and you'll see the beginnings of a schism.
It's an interesting thread alright. I'm curious Grommit, which of the problems facing the church do you think is more serious; the thorny issues or the a la carte catholics? How important is weekly mass attendance say over a catholic's thoughts on the thorny issues you mention?
If reports of dwindling mass attendances are to be believed, the church could be in serous trouble.
One point I'd make. The outrage at the hierarchy's handling of child rapists far outweighs the outrage felt directly towards the rapists. You seem to be suggesting it's the other way around. If proper procedures were in place priests guilty of rape and abuse would not have done it to more than one child. Of course that doesn't excuse them or make the revulsion felt towards them any less, but I think people's attitude towards the way in which they were passed on to other parishes allowing them to continue their evil deeds goes a long way to explain dwindling weekly mass attendances.
I'd love to see the church take a hard line on a la carte catholics. On that much we agree. How many parents 'go with the flow' when getting their kids baptised, communed and confirmed? It's just easier. Why would a church want huge swathes of its flock standing before an alter and blatantly lying when they promise to bring their children up as good catholics?
I also think that the church would be stronger and more confident in itself if it looked after the truely catholic population of Ireland.
I look forward to the end of cultural Catholicism, if it means divesting the church of schools and hospitals and the church shrinking back to contain only those who believe in it's tenets that can only be a good thing, for the adherents, for the vague "don't really hold with organised religion" Catholics but most of all for the rest of us.
So many lamp posts, so little rope.
It certainly wasn't independent, but until the mid 1800s the Irish Church was something of a rebellious child, retaining old practices, customs and traditions that Rome fought long and hard to stamp out.
It does not matter what branch of religion you fancy, they are all shyte. Who cares about the grammer?
Hey Grommit , if masterbation is a thorny issue for you, maybe you should clip your nails more often.
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