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  1. #21
    Fraxinus_ Fraxinus_ is offline

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    You see Antiphon you really know very little about this country, secularism is a relatively knew concept to Ireland and we had a fairly fuked up country before secularism came along too.
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  2. #22
    eyeswideopen eyeswideopen is offline

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    MPAC seem to be a group of provocateurs designed to discredit Islam.

    Ireland - Dubai - too much religion in both places imo, and much good it did in stopping an insane bubble in either place.
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  3. #23
    marmurr1916 marmurr1916 is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Antiphon View Post
    That's not my call, I'm not part of the group in Ireland. But they did answer a Mohammad Al kabur with the same or similar questions - the link is here: ?Muslims must rebuild civilisation?|MPAC.ie
    The only questions they answered were about links with Saudi Arabia (mpac.ie deny being funded by the Saudis) but they didn't answer any of the other questions.

    Here are the questions again, with some attempts at answers.

    Who are MPAC.IE?

    Nobody knows. Although Eoin Whelan and Liam Egan, both Irish Muslims, appear to be leading members.

    How many members do they have?

    Nobody knows. However, mpac.ie has 12 members (including Egan and Whelan) in its forum.

    How are they funded?

    Nobody knows.

    Who funds them?

    Nobody knows, although they claim it's not the Saudis.

    How representative of Irish Muslims are they?

    Nobody knows.
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  4. #24
    marmurr1916 marmurr1916 is offline

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    Now that we know roughly who mpac.ie are (a handful of unrepresentative nobodies), could the mods please change this thread title to 'Handful of unrepresentative nobodies blames secularism for Ireland's woes'?
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  5. #25
    IvoShandor IvoShandor is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouroux View Post
    I'm picking up on discriminatory undertones of various shades in this thread. The Muslim community is more that entitled to have a voice, given wider suffering and victimisation across the global Muslim population at the hands of the Western elitist foreign policy makers -the spiritual (versus material!) decline of the Universal Catholic Church will contribute to the already exponential growth of Islam in Europe and elsewhere. Who else can offer a real and indefatigable sense of community? It is also important to note that Islam promotes care of the 'other' (versus self) and that Iran recently appointed it's first female minister -a top position in government. Islam is perfectly capable of adapting to the needs of it's own people without reference to the pseudo-moral dictates of the 'enlightened' West.
    I'm shocked. Discriminating, are we? What shades, purple or green? would a second coat help to hide the undertones?
    The Muslim community...or some self-appointed weirdos claiming to speak for them, more likely.
    I'm no fan of the so-called Universal Church but if it's a choice between it and the grim-faced fatwa-producers of Jeddah and Teheran then its no contest. Compared to these twerps even the sour and reactionary Benny comes across as enlightened in comparison. And as for dictates, it's the bearded ones who seem to do most of the dictating as far as I can see. When this female minister can walk the street without wearing this scarf, when she can have a drink or watch a film she-and not the moral police-like, when she can sit on a park bench reading the Satanic Verses..then I'll be impressed and not before. We had a bellyful of that sort of thing in this country.
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  6. #26
    H.R. Haldeman H.R. Haldeman is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mouroux View Post
    the pseudo-moral dictates of the 'enlightened' West.
    Secularism, democracy, tolerance, multi-culturalism, freedom of speech, freedom of expression, press freedom, freedom of assembly, protections for minorities, equality legislation...

    If you are self-loathing enough to feel the need to put inverted commas around the word enlightened, that's fine. But to me it is spineless when you live in a country that allows you all these freedoms and yet you have the temerity to dismiss them as somehow bogus or illegitimate. Jesus F. Christ. Stick your nose out the bloody window and smell the fresh air ffs. People in the oppressive sh1tholes in the Muslim world you seem to be so concerned about would die for these freedoms (and many of them have died fighting to change their societies). You are playing with fire when you insult Western democracies in such a flippant way.
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  7. #27
    Cato Cato is offline
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antiphon View Post
    Ireland?s Shame ? Who is to Blame?|MPAC.ie

    This isn't one of those ideas that is simply 'out there' it is gaining currency.


    Type "why are muslims" into Google.
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  8. #28
    GabhaDubh GabhaDubh is online now
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    Here we go again. "there is only one religion and it is Islam" as if Islamic countries have no woes.
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  9. #29
    greenporcupine greenporcupine is offline

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    Mouroux is correct, The west is notably hypocritical in it's atitude to women,and many who are outside of the 'cosy' elite fantasie of a perfect liberal West .
    No, one does not like at all the 'burka' which is an insult to all who have to see it ,but come on.
    What about all the women/children who go missing ,are enslaved by pornographic predators,all those who are not free to be pure.Yes it is now compulsory to be mentally corrupted in the west .It is not a choice but condition of being accepted. No thanks .If only the 'haters 'could see their hate
    instead of projecting onto others.
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  10. #30
    Katayusha Mk2 Katayusha Mk2 is offline

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    Quote Originally Posted by Antiphon View Post
    Ireland?s Shame ? Who is to Blame?|MPAC.ie

    This isn't one of those ideas that is simply 'out there' it is gaining currency.
    Religion has played a huge part in the herding of the Irish people that has brought them to the current impasse. Your belief system is as corruptible as the next; you only have to look at the Anglo American / Wahhabi alliance that sees young Muslim lives fuel the enrichment of the most corrupt.

    We've had our fill of holy manipulators, the Irish people are starting to awaken from imposed slumber and the rise of secularism is a positive indication. You don't have to fear lakes of fire to make morally sound decisions. When people labour under such illusions they are easy prey to those who see through the Judeo-Christian myth.
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