Politics.ie
Advertise on Politics.ie

Go Back   Politics.ie > Issues > Economy
Politics.ie RSS (on Feedburner) Politics.ie on Facebook Politics.ie on Twitter
Forgot Password? Get Started - Join P.ie!

Ronan Lyons (Daft.ie) : NAMA figures on property LTEV are inflated

This is a discussion on Ronan Lyons (Daft.ie) : NAMA figures on property LTEV are inflated within the Economy forums, part of the Issues category on Politics.ie. Ronan posts here Do the NAMA figures add up? A broader and more realistic assessment of long-term economic value | ...

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 17th September 2009
Politics.ie Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,282
Default Ronan Lyons (Daft.ie) : NAMA figures on property LTEV are inflated

Ronan posts here
Do the NAMA figures add up? A broader and more realistic assessment of long-term economic value | Ronan Lyons

Quote:
Let’s see if I can recap and re-estimate long-term economic value. To keep things simple, we can say there are four types of loan that would go on NAMA’s books (the numbers in brackets are my best estimate of peak value, done by attributing associated loans, so the numbers add up to the €88bn original value reported):
  1. Irish commercial (€11.8bn)
  2. Irish residential (€12.4bn)
  3. Irish land (€31bn)
  4. All foreign (€31.6bn)
The two questions we need to know for each, to start discussing long-term economic value, are (1) how far have property values fallen so far, and (2) how far out is the yield based on current prices?
Let’s assume that NAMA and Jones Lang LaSalle got it right for the €8bn in commercial developments, i.e. that prices have fallen by 47% on average so far and that they will rise a little as yields level off to historical and European norms. This means that the €11bn in commercial projects in Ireland is now worth €6.2bn but will rise to €7.5bn.
What about the €12.4bn in residential property? There are no figures that suggest that the average fall anywhere, let alone the country as a whole, has been 47% yet. Based on discounts from asking price data, 35% is a more accurate average of the fall from the peak. However, the average yield in residential property is just over 3%, only about half a typical yield of 6% (this yield is by no means overly generous). This means that while the properties are probably worth €8bn now, their adjustment to long-term economic value would mean a downward adjustment to €4.2bn.
Regarding land and overseas projects, the value of Irish land has fallen dramatically and in many cases will not increase significantly as planned developments are scrapped. Overseas, property markets may be turning, having proven more flexible (in the case of the US) or less inflated (in the case of much of Europe). Let’s put to one side, then, the majority of NAMA’s loan book, i.e. Irish land and foreign properties of all sorts, on the assumption that they already reached approximately their long-term economic value. This means that based on what’s happening in residential and commercial property, one would expect a further 5% fall in the value of NAMA’s collateral – and not a 15% rise – as the market proceeds to its long-term economic value.
One further complication is rents, however. Rents in both commercial and residential segments of the market are falling, due to oversupply. If rents were to fall, say, 20% over the coming three years as they find their new level, this would mean a further fall in the value of commercial and residential property on NAMA’s books of €2.5bn.
In short, even if you think values for Irish land and foreign property have levelled off, estimating the true value of the €24bn in commercial and residential developments in Ireland does not translate into a straightforward mark-up of 15%. In fact, if you believe (a) that 6% is a healthy average yield for Irish property (as NAMA itself does), and (b) that it’s likely rents will fall a further 20% as the market handles recent overconstruction, the adjustment from current market value should be downwards by 10% to about €44bn, and not upwards to €54bn.
Does anyone know if there’s a 1% commission on saving the State €10bn?!
Reply With Quote
Adbreak

 

These ads aren't visible if you're logged in. To get started create a free account - click here!


  #2 (permalink)  
Old 17th September 2009
Politics.ie Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 152
Default

Also being discussed on the irisheconomy.ie blog:
The Irish Economy Blog Archive Ronan Lyons on Long-Term Economic Value
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 17th September 2009
Politics.ie Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Gort Na Cloca Mora
Posts: 2,619
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorpio View Post
Also being discussed on the irisheconomy.ie blog:
The Irish Economy Blog Archive Ronan Lyons on Long-Term Economic Value
Over inflated Ronans your man

Ronan Lyons introduces the Daft Rental Report
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 17th September 2009
Politics.ie Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,291
Default

But that would assume they are average loans and properties. The whole point of Nama is to shovel the &&&& off the banks balance sheets. So can we assume that these are in even worse nick than Daftman advises?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Will NAMA pay property tax? X-ray Economy 4 16th September 2009 05:53 PM
Nama : Ltev Dreaded_Estate Economy 67 14th September 2009 04:34 PM
Crash in property rental market confirmed - Daft report Digout Economy 53 18th February 2009 01:15 PM
Property down 1.2% in Q1 2008 - Daft report. digoutday Economy 62 9th April 2008 12:55 PM
Property-bee gone daft! Firefox Price Tracking Add-On Dreaded_Estate Economy 1 8th February 2008 06:10 PM


Advertise on Politics.ie

All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:28 PM.

Home - Contact Us - Advertise - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Top - © Pie Media Limited (Ireland)