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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold  Incidently, Post the link to the source material you are quoting. Ne a man for once. |
All the source material I’m quoting is here:
http://www.archives.gov/legislative/...t-sept2005.pdf
Which is what my first post was about and what we are supposed to be debating yes/no???
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold Firstly are you saying here that ATC in its entirity is complicit in the conspiracy? |
No, all you need is a small number of key individuals at the top to prevent an interception.
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold Secondly, why should it have started the process of contacting the military. For any reason, it might have been a malfunctioning radio? Oh thats right, lets contact NORAD, scramble 2 planes because a radio is in the wrong frequeuncy
Or the ATC could have contacts the AA Flight dispatcher to send a digital message to Flight 11 at 8:23 AM, saying "Good Morning ATC looking for you on 135.32"
Then 2 minutes later, ATC is finally aware that all is not well with Flight 11 when a foreigner voice came over the radio "We have some planes, just stay quiet and you will be okay. We are returning to the airport".
No... Of course ATC should have been aware at 8:14 Flight 11 was Hijacked. |
There’s no report of any correspondence between Boston and AA prior to the call by AA at 8:29, that’s 15 minutes after the first loss of contact and 7 minutes after the reported hijacking by Ong.
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold A ha. When did the AA System Operating Control contact ATC? So are American Airlines in on the conspiracy. |
I already answered this, they didn’t contact them until 8:29, a full 7 minutes after they knew the plane was hijacked and they called to ask about the status of Flight 11 and not to report the hijacking. How would they know that Boston knew about the hijacking at 8:25 if they hadn’t bothered to tell them?
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold Funnily enough, just because a plane doesn't respond to radio hails or acknowledge an instruction to climb from 29 k to 35 k feet - doesn't immedialtey make the plane hijacked. |
No it doesn’t, but it does indicate there’s a problem. Furthermore the transponder was switched off at 8:21 adding to the seriousness of the situation.
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold Unbelivable? Why exactly?
Incidently I fail to see how its relevant. Care to explain what it mattered WHAT American Airlines System Operations Control did after 8:25 when Boston ATC (a seperate entity) first became aware of a possible Hijacking?
Shocker... Chaotic situation involving hundreds of people means that the decision and information processing cycles slow down. |
It’s an unbelievable report because they knew the plane was hijacked at 8:22, yet we have this report at 8:33:
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American headquarters now suspected that Flight 11 had been hijacked.8
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And this report at 8:36:
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8:36 A.M. Marquis received Gonzalez's report about the hijacker she referred to as "Tom al Sukani" (i.e., Satam al Suqami), who had been seated in 10B.85 He then initiated action to "lockout" American Airlines Flight 11. This procedure is standard for airlines in safety and security incidents
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It’s probably not relevant to what Boston ATC did after 8:25 but it does show what a fantasy story the whole report is and that's why I referred to it.
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold Doesn't matter - ATC (you know, the guys who actually are in charge of the skies) didn't think the plane was Hijacked until 8:25. |
They lost radio contact at 8:14, transponder at 8:21 and SOC knew there was a hijacking at 8:22 but apparently didn’t bother telling anyone until the call at 8:29
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold So basically only 12 minutes after ATC had indications of the plane actually being hijacked and not suffering a radio malfunction?
Secondly, can you care to name the first time a kamikaze hujacking took place, and which flight was affected? |
you are doing what the whole report is trying to do, stretch out the timeline to justify no interception. Talking about a kamikaze hijacking is irrelevant to this, are you suggesting there’s a different procedure for suspected kamikaze hijackings?
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Originally Posted by Conor the Bold What you have failed Lthse, is highlight any area in which the Military or ATC did not follow procedure. I have, and these were attempts to shorten the response time, which in the case of NORAD would have resulted in a longer response time...
Lets not try to cherry pick the evidence shall we?
Try again... |
There’s no cherry picking of evidence, the first report to the military was at 8:37, and we are lead to believe that this was a shortcut. Why weren’t the military notified at 8:22 when SOC acknowledged the hijacking, or at 8:21 when the transponder was switched off or at 8:25 when Boston knew it was a hijacking?
Or what about this report at 8:32:
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8:32 A.M. The Herndon Command Center notified the Operations Center at FAA headquarters in Washington, D.C., of the possible hijacking of Flight 11, and was told that FAA security personnel at headquarters had just begun discussing the hijacking on a conference call with the agency’s New England regional office.
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Why didn't the FAA notify the military?
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8:37:52 A.M. Boston Center called
the North American Aerospace
Defense Command's (NORAD)
Northeast Air Defense Sector
(NEADS) and notified NEADS
about the suspected hijacking of
Flightl 1.88 The United States'
military defense of its homeland on
9/11 began with this call. Indeed,
this was the first notification
received by the military - at any
level - that Flight 11 had been
hijacked.
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I have shown from the report itself that nobody in the military, at any level, was notified of the hijacking until 8:37. SOC knew at 8:22, Boston knew there was serious problem from 8:21, the FAA knew prior to 8:32 yet nobody contacted the military. The whole report is a farce.